Council spy car set to crackdown on illegal drivers in Blackburn and Darwen (From Lancashire Telegraph)
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Council spy car set to crackdown on illegal drivers in Blackburn and Darwen
11:00am Thursday 13th September 2012 in Darwen
By Bill Jacobs, Local government reporter
GOTCHA An ANPR camera
A CONTROVERSIAL ‘spy’ car is set to crackdown on illegal parkers and motorists driving in bus lanes.
Mums and dads stopping on double yellow lines outside schools to drop off and pick up children will be a top target of the vehicle in Blackburn and Darwen.
The £50,000 plus council car would be able to capture offending motorists on camera and use automatic number plate recognition to issue fines of £60 or £70 a time.
The device would mean tickets could be issued for the first time without a parking warden present.
Borough transport chief Dave Harling said that officials were working on a plan to bring in the spy car as well as the use of a small number of movable CCTV cameras.
The scheme will be put before senior councillors in November.
Coun Harling said thoughtless school run parents would be a major target for the car.
To use the car, Blackburn with Darwen Council will have to get special permission from Whitehall to become one of just over 20 local authorities outside London to have “remote enforcement” powers over parking offences and illegal driving in bus lanes.
It would then take six months to a year to get permission from the Transport Department in London.
Blackburn MP Jack Straw welcomed the proposal despite having being fined £60 after being caught by a similar car in London earlier this year.
Borough Tory opposition leader Mike Lee said: “It is a good idea, provided it is used for improving road safety rather than raising revenue.”
The vehicle, similar to one that has sparked angry controversy in Bolton since its introduction in 2009, would also be used to combat reckless parking on ‘dangerous’ routes.
The Bolton vehicle has been criticised for raising £250,000 a year, with 4,000 tickets costing £70 being issued each year - despite many being subsequently cancelled.
Civil liberties campaign group Big Brother Watch said: “The CCTV car represents a very dangerous escalation in Britain’s surveillance society. These vehicles are sent out to catch people and make money, with road safety only an afterthought.”
Coun Harling said: “We need to apply for special powers to use this type of car and also to fix small cameras to lamposts or traffic lights to tackle hotspots. It would be much quicker and easier than using patrol officers.
“We are talking about improving road safety, especially near schools, not raising money.
“The car, which would costs tens of thousands of pounds to buy and run, and cameras would deal with illegal parking in the town centre and driving bus lanes as well.
“If we go ahead in November it would take six months to a year to get the necessary approvals and bring in.”
Mr Straw said: “It’s a good idea. It works well in London. I say that despite being caught inadvertently driving in a bus lane by one recently and having to pay a £60 fine. It improves road safety and helps the traffic flow smoothly.”
Comments(53)
lwg76
says...
11:29am Thu 13 Sep 12
Cut Council Services to the Elderly and Sick. But find Loads a Money to keep the Motorist in its Place and to protect the Empty Bus Lanes as Bus Services continue to be lost
BritainfortheBritish
says...
11:32am Thu 13 Sep 12
lwg76 wrote:Tend to agree with this. We all know it,s about the council getting more fines money .
Here, Here.
Cut Council Services to the Elderly and Sick. But find Loads a Money to keep the Motorist in its Place and to protect the Empty Bus Lanes as Bus Services continue to be lost
But also if you do not do it you will not get fined.
nonjob
says...
11:47am Thu 13 Sep 12
w w w.nonjob.tumblr.com
DtheP47
says...
11:49am Thu 13 Sep 12
AND to quote above:
Civil liberties campaign group Big Brother Watch said: “The CCTV car represents a very dangerous escalation in Britain’s surveillance society. These vehicles are sent out to catch people and make money, with road safety only an afterthought.”
Britain's surveillance society?? If 25 years ago the government of the time had said " You all have to go round with a little device round your neck which will tell us where you are at any time of the day or night" there would have been rioting in the streets. NOW we all go into Carphone Warehouse or whatever, get our Nokias and Blackberrys which allows just that AND we are happy to pay for them without a peep about survellance society !!
burner
says...
12:09pm Thu 13 Sep 12
.
However, like others on here, I am all for punishing anti-social behaviour by motorists. THEN take out the annoying yoofs on street corners !!
A Darener
says...
12:10pm Thu 13 Sep 12
paulc
says...
12:14pm Thu 13 Sep 12
lwg76 wrote:Eh?
Here, Here.
Cut Council Services to the Elderly and Sick. But find Loads a Money to keep the Motorist in its Place and to protect the Empty Bus Lanes as Bus Services continue to be lost
What better way to pay for services than a £70 tax on idiot motorists? I can't think of any.
Rovers til I cry
says...
12:14pm Thu 13 Sep 12
Skookie
says...
12:32pm Thu 13 Sep 12
JayEss
says...
12:33pm Thu 13 Sep 12
burner wrote:You can't always automate driving without insurance policing.
MUCH more money to be had by catching those without insurance ( a CRIMINAL offence ) but . . .. then the money doesn't go to the council, does it?
.
However, like others on here, I am all for punishing anti-social behaviour by motorists. THEN take out the annoying yoofs on street corners !!
It's the driver of the car that needs to be insured. Provided someone has insured the car then a number plate search wouldn't pick up a problem.
But, yes, driving without insurance is a big issue and should be targeted. There is a database so a random stop & search occasionally would be useful.
makaveli96
says...
12:47pm Thu 13 Sep 12
Like a loyalty discount or clubcard scheme.....
brian jones
says...
12:48pm Thu 13 Sep 12
Anyone who does receive such a penalty should always check it very carefully to make sure that the council has got it right. It must contain specific wording and must also be served in a particular way (for example the date of service should match the postmark). A website called pepipoo is always every helpful in this regard. While I think it's great that the council are tackling dangerous parkers, they too must ensure that they abide by the rules set out for them, and if they fail to do so, then their penalty notices must fail.
Fire Fly
says...
12:48pm Thu 13 Sep 12
Chugger
says...
12:49pm Thu 13 Sep 12
jack daniels
says...
1:05pm Thu 13 Sep 12
nonjob wrote:Do we have to go through the whole argument again before you retract your comment about council staff being parasites?
Yet more parasitic behaviour from Blackburn with Darwen council. w w w.nonjob.tumblr.com
The council wouldn't have to waste money on this project if people didn't break the law.
nonjob
says...
1:15pm Thu 13 Sep 12
jack daniels wrote:Jack, put the bottle away, you’ll damage your liver. You‘ve already pickled your brain.
nonjob wrote:Do we have to go through the whole argument again before you retract your comment about council staff being parasites?
Yet more parasitic behaviour from Blackburn with Darwen council. w w w.nonjob.tumblr.com
The council wouldn't have to waste money on this project if people didn't break the law.
jack daniels
says...
1:21pm Thu 13 Sep 12
The yellow lines are there for a reason. If this proactive action stops one accident per year, it will be worth while compared to the lifetime of potential hardship for the family and child, disability benefit payments, hospital costs
.... or a funeral.
A classic example of the public sector helping the most vulnerable in todays society - our children
jack daniels
says...
1:22pm Thu 13 Sep 12
nonjob wrote:the fact you've gone straight to the baby insults shows that I'm right.
jack daniels wrote:Jack, put the bottle away, you’ll damage your liver. You‘ve already pickled your brain.nonjob wrote: Yet more parasitic behaviour from Blackburn with Darwen council. w w w.nonjob.tumblr.comDo we have to go through the whole argument again before you retract your comment about council staff being parasites? The council wouldn't have to waste money on this project if people didn't break the law.
Your selfishness is on show for us all to see.
peely
says...
1:27pm Thu 13 Sep 12
nonjob
says...
1:38pm Thu 13 Sep 12
This is a done-to-death, and totally worthless argument. You could justify just about anything with such halfwit logic. What about cameras in peoples bathrooms? Why not? If it saves just one life?
Please think Jack. Thinking is so important.
From middle management up, the councils are nothing more than jobs club gravy trains for feckless parasites. They are still playing a major role in bringing this country to its knees.
I will leave it there, i really do not have the time to debate with fools.
w w w.nonjob.tumblr.com
Rumpole
says...
1:51pm Thu 13 Sep 12
If parking outside schools and parents dropping kids off at school is such an issue why not use the cctv systems already installed in schools to monitor the perimeter of the school and let the schools deal with parents and lazy kids!
Would make more sense to monitor the perimeter than to monitor the toilets, makes you wonder about the people that decided this was right!
jack daniels
says...
1:51pm Thu 13 Sep 12
nonjob wrote:Ahh, so it's only "From middle management up" who are the parasites now.
jack daniels says: "If this proactive action stops one accident per year, it will be worth" (sic) This is a done-to-death, and totally worthless argument. You could justify just about anything with such halfwit logic. What about cameras in peoples bathrooms? Why not? If it saves just one life? Please think Jack. Thinking is so important. From middle management up, the councils are nothing more than jobs club gravy trains for feckless parasites. They are still playing a major role in bringing this country to its knees. I will leave it there, i really do not have the time to debate with fools. w w w.nonjob.tumblr.com
You've already amended your argument in the space of 111minutes.
What else are you going to change before the days out?
alf-abett
says...
1:53pm Thu 13 Sep 12
peely wrote:Excellent point, but only for the short term are they the minority. Anyone with sense and a bit of brass got out of Blackburn some time back but others are just waking up to what the future holds in this dump and will get out at the earliest the others!, well, they are the ones who cannot / will not move for whatever reason and that's where the minority will be. Poor sods.
Let,s see if they start with the most obvious places in Blackburn but I wouldn't,t hold your breath.Dont want to be upsetting the minorities do we?
S4AWX100
says...
2:01pm Thu 13 Sep 12
woolywords
says...
2:07pm Thu 13 Sep 12
vicn1956
says...
2:15pm Thu 13 Sep 12
A Darener
says...
2:23pm Thu 13 Sep 12
nonjob
says...
2:25pm Thu 13 Sep 12
There was a landmark ruling in April on these spy cars by the Traffic Penalty Tribunal Adjudicator.
He said, "The sensitive nature of evidence gathered by CCTV is specifically considered and addressed by the guidance issued by the Government.
"Recommendation is made that such devices are only used where enforcement is difficult, sensitive or enforcement by wardens is not practical."
I am certain that the dullards in Blackburn and Darwen council will not even be aware of this ruling.
As someone who has had dealings with various councils on such matters, i can assure you that not once have i found one single council who understood fully the 1998 Data Protection act and its implications as regards the use of these cameras.
Hence, cctv cameras are abused by tin-pot councils and the already hard-pressed motorist is used as a cash cow. Easy pickings.
If you become a victim to such council shenanigans, seek legal advice and challenge them.
w w w.nonjob.tumblr.com
And wasn't Dave Harling the council "regeneration boss" last week? But this week he is the "transport chief"?
woolywords
says...
2:31pm Thu 13 Sep 12
vicn1956 wrote:Funny you should mention parking around that area, as I'd always thought that parking on the footpath was illegal. Yet not long after the whole range was block paved vehicles were not only parking with two wheels on the road, some were parking entirely on the footpath.
wardens are already employed to catch these people- can't they walk to Audley Range/Bastwell where you can find many parking on double yellow lines through the day. Can't they spend time with a camera recording drivers in bus lanes? Do you need to spend £50,000 on a vehicle.
When I mentioned this to someone I know to be a warden he told me that they had been instructed to advise rather than issue tickets immediately.
eastlancslad
says...
2:59pm Thu 13 Sep 12
lwg76
says...
3:03pm Thu 13 Sep 12
I was informed quite categorically that the Borough could not justify any expense in improving a certain dangerous junction in the Borough, no matter how dangerous it was, until after a Fatality. So the principle is there. Sloo oope Shoulders.
HairyBowls
says...
3:07pm Thu 13 Sep 12
HairyBowls
says...
3:07pm Thu 13 Sep 12
real betis hotpot
says...
3:38pm Thu 13 Sep 12
Mikeee47
says...
3:39pm Thu 13 Sep 12
HairyBowls wrote:we already live in a police state or haven't you noticed? we're all guilty until WE can prove our innocense.
lol...The council should'nt concern itself with law enforement in any form. Once you start blurring the lines between policing and local government, you are halfway to a police state.
Izanears
says...
4:41pm Thu 13 Sep 12
accyphil
says...
5:10pm Thu 13 Sep 12
enki jr
says...
6:01pm Thu 13 Sep 12
no victim..no crime... that is the law of the land. of course straw will support the parasites, he backed a law to silence abused children by locking them up if they complain to anyone outside the pedo-ring social services..he is pondslime. Under common law we can travel anywhere without being obstructed or paying a penalty, this means that all parking tickets and more to the point SPEEDBUMPS
are contrary to common law and the councils are conning you with bumps and 20mph restrictions ...one word..treason. unfortunately the general consensus of unknowledgable entities go along with it because, they are clueless as to real law and fake commercial law ... if you dont want tickets on your windscreen, or if you want the right to
forcebly remove wheelclamps and make the clampers pay for the priviledge, then go to getoutofdebtfree.org and download a notice you can put on your vehicle to give you the right you always had but didnt know because the treasonous councils are cheating you, you can also download notices to stick on your doors to keep parasitic bailiffs away too ... You need to start fighting back instead of allowing these corporate cowboys to rob you..its theft and fraud, under common law its the gov who are the crims, and you are the victims of crime.
johndarwen
says...
6:48pm Thu 13 Sep 12
You need the opstruction moved rite away, not just fined.
It is only good to make money.
Remember the days when Traffic wardens used to ask in shops who's is the car parked Illeagly?
The council will not make money, but I bet Capita does !!
jack daniels
says...
8:27pm Thu 13 Sep 12
nonjob wrote:So what's your solution big man?
For those who have a genuine interest in this subject, and especially if you live in an area that will be affected if Blackburn and Darwen council get the go-ahead for their latest racket - get informed.
There was a landmark ruling in April on these spy cars by the Traffic Penalty Tribunal Adjudicator.
He said, "The sensitive nature of evidence gathered by CCTV is specifically considered and addressed by the guidance issued by the Government.
"Recommendation is made that such devices are only used where enforcement is difficult, sensitive or enforcement by wardens is not practical."
I am certain that the dullards in Blackburn and Darwen council will not even be aware of this ruling.
As someone who has had dealings with various councils on such matters, i can assure you that not once have i found one single council who understood fully the 1998 Data Protection act and its implications as regards the use of these cameras.
Hence, cctv cameras are abused by tin-pot councils and the already hard-pressed motorist is used as a cash cow. Easy pickings.
If you become a victim to such council shenanigans, seek legal advice and challenge them.
w w w.nonjob.tumblr.com
And wasn't Dave Harling the council "regeneration boss" last week? But this week he is the "transport chief"?
Anybody with a pc can have an opinion but if there's a problem with people parking like idiots (and enough people on here have said as such) what do you propose?
Somehow, an unread blog will make a difference.....
jack daniels
says...
8:32pm Thu 13 Sep 12
jack daniels wrote:Not...!
nonjob wrote:So what's your solution big man?
For those who have a genuine interest in this subject, and especially if you live in an area that will be affected if Blackburn and Darwen council get the go-ahead for their latest racket - get informed.
There was a landmark ruling in April on these spy cars by the Traffic Penalty Tribunal Adjudicator.
He said, "The sensitive nature of evidence gathered by CCTV is specifically considered and addressed by the guidance issued by the Government.
"Recommendation is made that such devices are only used where enforcement is difficult, sensitive or enforcement by wardens is not practical."
I am certain that the dullards in Blackburn and Darwen council will not even be aware of this ruling.
As someone who has had dealings with various councils on such matters, i can assure you that not once have i found one single council who understood fully the 1998 Data Protection act and its implications as regards the use of these cameras.
Hence, cctv cameras are abused by tin-pot councils and the already hard-pressed motorist is used as a cash cow. Easy pickings.
If you become a victim to such council shenanigans, seek legal advice and challenge them.
w w w.nonjob.tumblr.com
And wasn't Dave Harling the council "regeneration boss" last week? But this week he is the "transport chief"?
Anybody with a pc can have an opinion but if there's a problem with people parking like idiots (and enough people on here have said as such) what do you propose?
Somehow, an unread blog will make a difference.....
Info-warrior
says...
8:33pm Thu 13 Sep 12
It will get clamped...
ste.g
says...
9:03pm Thu 13 Sep 12
goz
says...
10:54pm Thu 13 Sep 12
A Darener wrote:Absolutely, like the traffic wardens who patrol Ewood on matchdays who park on double yellow lines then leave the van there whilst they go round booking others for not having resident permits. Just a small point about illegal parking outside schools, My youngest is still at junior school and i would say at least once every couple of months the local police officer for the area gets himself up there and outside the school and warns any parents who park illegally, its rare now to find anyone parked directly outside the school due to this officers good work, can the same not be done by other policemen ?? Waste £50000 of taxpayers money on a car to do this ??? Sorry but I agree with those who say its just a council run cash cow !!!
What's the betting this car will be illegally parked whilst catching motorists?
mark007
says...
8:33am Fri 14 Sep 12
makaveli96 wrote:you can use your beez card
Do you get a discount if you were born and have lived in the town all your life?
Like a loyalty discount or clubcard scheme.....
Black Car Guy.
says...
2:06pm Fri 14 Sep 12
pwitch
says...
3:39pm Fri 14 Sep 12
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HarwoodBiker
says...
5:30pm Fri 14 Sep 12
I would just say one thing, which is hopefully the council won't shy away from reporting their own vans, which I have seen illegally parked many a time!
logie28
says...
7:06pm Fri 14 Sep 12
This council is a disgrace !
Why waste £50,000 + of taxpayers cash on a car with a camera?
Lets deal in facts, this car will be illegally parked when issuing fines, how do I know?
I've seen them in greater Manchester, parked on pavements and grass verges, collecting evidence of people on phones and not wearing seat belts.. Fact
Fact Two, The PCSO's in Lancashire have the power to issue fines, Lancashire Constabulary applied for this when PCSO's where introduced.
Lancashire constabulary will not impose this power though, don't know why, i've wrote to the CC. No reply!
PCSO's are posted to schools, there is often one at my childs school. Sat on a wall chatting to parents, Great job.
Ask him to speak to the illegal parkers, it's like asking a bank manager to give you a mortgage! Not a chance.
Why won't the the constabulary allow PCSO's to issue fines, simple answer....
The revenue can not be kept and goes to the Government, Not worth the hassle for nothing.
The council however, they keep it.
Let's keep shouting that "school" rubbish and safety talk..
It's all about the money!!
lencho
says...
8:11pm Sat 15 Sep 12
--------------------
Quisling is synonymous with traitor, and particularly applied to politicians who appear to favour the interests of other nations or cultures over their own.
Darwen Malc
says...
12:23am Mon 17 Sep 12
accy lad and proud says...
11:20am Thu 13 Sep 12