I quit, says Darwen landlady after four months

A more optimistic Les and Babs Greenall at Darwen’s White Lion when they took over

A more optimistic Les and Babs Greenall at Darwen’s White Lion when they took over

First published in News
Last updated
Lancashire Telegraph: Photograph of the Author by , Reporter

AN historic town centre pub is to close after its manager decided to pull out just four months after opening.

The White Lion in The Green, Darwen, will close once its current stock of beer runs out after licensee Barbara Greenall decided she had had enough.

Barbara, 44, who has also previously run The Entwistle pub in Darwen, reopened the pub following a small refurbishment on March 7, after it had been shut since January.

But a lack of trade has forced her to move on after just a short time behind the bar. Barbara said: “It just hasn’t worked out. It is just dying.

“England were playing on Thursday night and I had two customers in.

“Once all the beer is gone we are going. We probably have enough to last until Sunday.

“We used to get a lot of passing trade but we do not seem to get it now.

“It is just one of those things.”

Andrew Buchanan, director of pub operations at Thwaites, said: “Matters relating to the tenancy at the White Lion are currently in dispute. No commercial agreement exists between Thwaites and Babs Greenall and it is our intention to sell the pub once these matters have been resolved.”

When Barbara, originally from St Helens, took over the pub in March, she told the Lancashire Telegraph she wanted to make the pub a good live music venue and, eventually start serving food.

The decision to close emerged when disappointed bands that had been booked to play wrote on an online forum that they had been called to say the gig was off.

On the North West Bands website, a member of Accrington rockers Recycled Teenagers wrote: “Had a call from Babs cancelling all gigs. The pub is closing as so many before. RIP White Lion.”

A member of band Crossroads said: “We played there a few weeks ago. Good venue, but up against a lot of competition within a very small area. Sad to see it go.”

Comments (24)

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9:27pm Mon 23 Jun 14

Real Ale Up North says...

There's something odd here. Lots of pubs in and around Darwen are thriving. Two customers on the night England were playing? Are you sure? Sad to see another pub close. However, there's more to this than meets the eye - in my opinion.
There's something odd here. Lots of pubs in and around Darwen are thriving. Two customers on the night England were playing? Are you sure? Sad to see another pub close. However, there's more to this than meets the eye - in my opinion. Real Ale Up North
  • Score: 36

11:19pm Mon 23 Jun 14

fireonthemountain says...

Yes - Real Ale Up North , I agree and I do not understand .

Now here I have to delve into my memory - I welcome opinions , facts and corrections from all .

I remember The White Lion as an absolutely brilliant pub . Approx 20 years ago it was run by a really good guy called John .

Mind you , then Borough Road (? I think) , started off at The Circus , on that side of town , with Barclays bank , then a corner type shop , can't remember who , then Midland Bank , the Post Office , Eleccy Board , another shop I can't remember , then a Furniture shop .

Lots of foot traffic - now ? - a main road , which in all honesty defies logic . Try and cross the road - take your life in your hands .

And , I'm sorry but I can't remember , what used to be there before they built The Health Centre ? Was it houses ?

Darwen used to have a thriving town centre .

Remember Burtons , Woolworths ?

That "side"of the road had it all ,

Sorry and sad to see the demise of The White Lion .
I will be having a pint there this week , and I will wish the young lady all the best for her future endeavours .
Yes - Real Ale Up North , I agree and I do not understand . Now here I have to delve into my memory - I welcome opinions , facts and corrections from all . I remember The White Lion as an absolutely brilliant pub . Approx 20 years ago it was run by a really good guy called John . Mind you , then Borough Road (? I think) , started off at The Circus , on that side of town , with Barclays bank , then a corner type shop , can't remember who , then Midland Bank , the Post Office , Eleccy Board , another shop I can't remember , then a Furniture shop . Lots of foot traffic - now ? - a main road , which in all honesty defies logic . Try and cross the road - take your life in your hands . And , I'm sorry but I can't remember , what used to be there before they built The Health Centre ? Was it houses ? Darwen used to have a thriving town centre . Remember Burtons , Woolworths ? That "side"of the road had it all , Sorry and sad to see the demise of The White Lion . I will be having a pint there this week , and I will wish the young lady all the best for her future endeavours . fireonthemountain
  • Score: 13

11:28pm Mon 23 Jun 14

2 for 5p ridesagain says...

Well well well. I said I give it 6 months.
Cant be right about everything.
Well well well. I said I give it 6 months. Cant be right about everything. 2 for 5p ridesagain
  • Score: -24

12:20am Tue 24 Jun 14

Openminded? says...

Shall we blame the Muslims for this? :)
Shall we blame the Muslims for this? :) Openminded?
  • Score: -8

6:43am Tue 24 Jun 14

Excluded again says...

fireonthemountain wrote:
Yes - Real Ale Up North , I agree and I do not understand .

Now here I have to delve into my memory - I welcome opinions , facts and corrections from all .

I remember The White Lion as an absolutely brilliant pub . Approx 20 years ago it was run by a really good guy called John .

Mind you , then Borough Road (? I think) , started off at The Circus , on that side of town , with Barclays bank , then a corner type shop , can't remember who , then Midland Bank , the Post Office , Eleccy Board , another shop I can't remember , then a Furniture shop .

Lots of foot traffic - now ? - a main road , which in all honesty defies logic . Try and cross the road - take your life in your hands .

And , I'm sorry but I can't remember , what used to be there before they built The Health Centre ? Was it houses ?

Darwen used to have a thriving town centre .

Remember Burtons , Woolworths ?

That "side"of the road had it all ,

Sorry and sad to see the demise of The White Lion .
I will be having a pint there this week , and I will wish the young lady all the best for her future endeavours .
I think you are missing the obvious. Its a Thwaites pub.

Four new pubs have opened in Darwen Town Centre in the last few years. Most of the factors you cite would be common to these new pubs as well. At the same time Thwaites has been closing pubs in Darwen. The way Thwaites manages its pubs doesn't work.

The land the health centre was built on was derelict - no housing there for decades. If anything the health centre has created footfall past the White Lion as has the Leisure Centre. Whoever manages the White Lion needs to think: all these people wandering past my door in the daytime. What should I offer to entice them in?
[quote][p][bold]fireonthemountain[/bold] wrote: Yes - Real Ale Up North , I agree and I do not understand . Now here I have to delve into my memory - I welcome opinions , facts and corrections from all . I remember The White Lion as an absolutely brilliant pub . Approx 20 years ago it was run by a really good guy called John . Mind you , then Borough Road (? I think) , started off at The Circus , on that side of town , with Barclays bank , then a corner type shop , can't remember who , then Midland Bank , the Post Office , Eleccy Board , another shop I can't remember , then a Furniture shop . Lots of foot traffic - now ? - a main road , which in all honesty defies logic . Try and cross the road - take your life in your hands . And , I'm sorry but I can't remember , what used to be there before they built The Health Centre ? Was it houses ? Darwen used to have a thriving town centre . Remember Burtons , Woolworths ? That "side"of the road had it all , Sorry and sad to see the demise of The White Lion . I will be having a pint there this week , and I will wish the young lady all the best for her future endeavours .[/p][/quote]I think you are missing the obvious. Its a Thwaites pub. Four new pubs have opened in Darwen Town Centre in the last few years. Most of the factors you cite would be common to these new pubs as well. At the same time Thwaites has been closing pubs in Darwen. The way Thwaites manages its pubs doesn't work. The land the health centre was built on was derelict - no housing there for decades. If anything the health centre has created footfall past the White Lion as has the Leisure Centre. Whoever manages the White Lion needs to think: all these people wandering past my door in the daytime. What should I offer to entice them in? Excluded again
  • Score: 26

7:56am Tue 24 Jun 14

child44 says...

Thwaites -AGAIN. The sign on top of the brewery a couple of months ago wasn't wrong.
Thwaites -AGAIN. The sign on top of the brewery a couple of months ago wasn't wrong. child44
  • Score: 27

9:13am Tue 24 Jun 14

Real Ale Up North says...

I do have to concur with Excluded again. Thwaites closed a pub up the road near Feniscowles a few years ago. It looked a proper eyesore having been boarded-up for about 18 months. Thankfully, the Black Bull was bought by a local independent brewer, Three B's. It soon became a thriving pub and is now one of the finest watering holes in the county. The pub has deservedly just scooped CAMRA's Lancashire Pub of the Year.
Perhaps Thwaites, do indeed,have a problem with their business model.
I do have to concur with Excluded again. Thwaites closed a pub up the road near Feniscowles a few years ago. It looked a proper eyesore having been boarded-up for about 18 months. Thankfully, the Black Bull was bought by a local independent brewer, Three B's. It soon became a thriving pub and is now one of the finest watering holes in the county. The pub has deservedly just scooped CAMRA's Lancashire Pub of the Year. Perhaps Thwaites, do indeed,have a problem with their business model. Real Ale Up North
  • Score: 32

9:14am Tue 24 Jun 14

Pintofbitter says...

Sell Thwaites to a company that will care about pubs and the people who run them.
Thwaites seem to be selling pubs to resolve a cash problem.
Sell Thwaites to a company that will care about pubs and the people who run them. Thwaites seem to be selling pubs to resolve a cash problem. Pintofbitter
  • Score: 26

9:32am Tue 24 Jun 14

hasslem hasslem says...

thwaites doesnt seem to give a monkey's chuff about its beer (moving production down to the Midlands), its pubs (see the a above story) or the town that made its fortune (combine the two).

Its a crying shame that what used to be a proud business is a shadow of its former self. as real ale up north says - look at the black bull at tockholes - it doesnt seem to be affected by the economy or the drink driving country pub debate. - look at moorhouses who are eating thwaites lunch (or drinking it) and finally look at darwen - pubs are actually opening in darwen...the night-time economy is actually thriving, for everybody except thwaites. two george pubs shut, brittania, cemetery, mill gap, white lion - there are a few which remain steadfast and the golden cup shows it can be done in a thwaites establishment.

thwaites regrettably through appalling management is a company and brand whose time has been and gone - the directors should hang their head in shame.

would you like a pint of smooth?
thwaites doesnt seem to give a monkey's chuff about its beer (moving production down to the Midlands), its pubs (see the a above story) or the town that made its fortune (combine the two). Its a crying shame that what used to be a proud business is a shadow of its former self. as real ale up north says - look at the black bull at tockholes - it doesnt seem to be affected by the economy or the drink driving country pub debate. - look at moorhouses who are eating thwaites lunch (or drinking it) and finally look at darwen - pubs are actually opening in darwen...the night-time economy is actually thriving, for everybody except thwaites. two george pubs shut, brittania, cemetery, mill gap, white lion - there are a few which remain steadfast and the golden cup shows it can be done in a thwaites establishment. thwaites regrettably through appalling management is a company and brand whose time has been and gone - the directors should hang their head in shame. would you like a pint of smooth? hasslem hasslem
  • Score: 26

9:43am Tue 24 Jun 14

Footysmithy__6 says...

I'm from Birmingham, but my old man is from Blackburn, so go up there quite a lot for the football. It's clear to see from an outsiders POV (who goes up once a month at least) that Thwaites is still living in the past. Old looking, dingy pubs don't do much anymore. Three B's has got modern, spacious and bright pubs which make it more welcoming. As much as I love having a pint of Thwaites (as don't get it down here), the pubs are something different and are in desperate need of modernisation and living with the times!
I'm from Birmingham, but my old man is from Blackburn, so go up there quite a lot for the football. It's clear to see from an outsiders POV (who goes up once a month at least) that Thwaites is still living in the past. Old looking, dingy pubs don't do much anymore. Three B's has got modern, spacious and bright pubs which make it more welcoming. As much as I love having a pint of Thwaites (as don't get it down here), the pubs are something different and are in desperate need of modernisation and living with the times! Footysmithy__6
  • Score: 17

10:19am Tue 24 Jun 14

HelmshoreBoy says...

Openminded? wrote:
Shall we blame the Muslims for this? :)
What the hell is it to do with Muslims. Its a sign of the times. Things are tight.

You are a really feeble minded, bacon loving, sausage mother, pork chop sucker, individual rascist.

Openminded? More like narrowminded! Ar**hole!!
[quote][p][bold]Openminded?[/bold] wrote: Shall we blame the Muslims for this? :)[/p][/quote]What the hell is it to do with Muslims. Its a sign of the times. Things are tight. You are a really feeble minded, bacon loving, sausage mother, pork chop sucker, individual rascist. Openminded? More like narrowminded! Ar**hole!! HelmshoreBoy
  • Score: 10

10:38am Tue 24 Jun 14

GracesDad says...

HelmshoreBoy wrote:
Openminded? wrote:
Shall we blame the Muslims for this? :)
What the hell is it to do with Muslims. Its a sign of the times. Things are tight.

You are a really feeble minded, bacon loving, sausage mother, pork chop sucker, individual rascist.

Openminded? More like narrowminded! Ar**hole!!
It's a running joke that you haven't been involved in. You've just made yourself look a right dick.
[quote][p][bold]HelmshoreBoy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Openminded?[/bold] wrote: Shall we blame the Muslims for this? :)[/p][/quote]What the hell is it to do with Muslims. Its a sign of the times. Things are tight. You are a really feeble minded, bacon loving, sausage mother, pork chop sucker, individual rascist. Openminded? More like narrowminded! Ar**hole!![/p][/quote]It's a running joke that you haven't been involved in. You've just made yourself look a right dick. GracesDad
  • Score: 39

11:17am Tue 24 Jun 14

Casper's mum says...

This weekend I visited a Thwaites pub and 2 non-Thwaites pubs. It cost almost £3 more for a like-for-like round in the Thwaites pub than the other 2 meaning we could buy 2 rounds at Thwaites or 3 rounds in the others. The atmosphere and décor was better in both of the non-Thwaites pubs too

Next time we go out, I know which pubs we'll be drinking in.

Thwaites are not helping themselves or their landlords.
This weekend I visited a Thwaites pub and 2 non-Thwaites pubs. It cost almost £3 more for a like-for-like round in the Thwaites pub than the other 2 meaning we could buy 2 rounds at Thwaites or 3 rounds in the others. The atmosphere and décor was better in both of the non-Thwaites pubs too Next time we go out, I know which pubs we'll be drinking in. Thwaites are not helping themselves or their landlords. Casper's mum
  • Score: 13

11:26am Tue 24 Jun 14

Cherry Benables says...

You only need to look at The Millstone to see what Thwaites think of pubs. Wouldn't be surprised to see that going the way of The White Lion before too long.
You only need to look at The Millstone to see what Thwaites think of pubs. Wouldn't be surprised to see that going the way of The White Lion before too long. Cherry Benables
  • Score: 11

11:27am Tue 24 Jun 14

Darren Aires says...

Thwaites don't care about beer or Blackburn and haven't done for as long as I remember. They are not alone though, many big pub companies have terrible work practices. Pubs are shutting left, right and centre and it is mainly the 'traditional' boozer' which is under threat. There are many reasons for this notably the nation's inexplicable lack of enthusiasm for socialising. It is a shame that a massive part of Britain's heritage is being lost and not enough people care. Politicians may not like to hear it but yes.....The old fashioned ale house is a big part of OUR HERITAGE. Unfortunately politicians are just as uncaring as the pub companies - until of course it affects their pockets.
Thwaites don't care about beer or Blackburn and haven't done for as long as I remember. They are not alone though, many big pub companies have terrible work practices. Pubs are shutting left, right and centre and it is mainly the 'traditional' boozer' which is under threat. There are many reasons for this notably the nation's inexplicable lack of enthusiasm for socialising. It is a shame that a massive part of Britain's heritage is being lost and not enough people care. Politicians may not like to hear it but yes.....The old fashioned ale house is a big part of OUR HERITAGE. Unfortunately politicians are just as uncaring as the pub companies - until of course it affects their pockets. Darren Aires
  • Score: 13

1:24pm Tue 24 Jun 14

Reality50 says...

Thwaites as said earlier are living in the past and their pubs are indeed tired and decaying in the main. The death of the pub industry is a national disgrace and shame and as a country we will regret in years to come,the passing of a powerhouse great industry. Who to blame? Breweries first and foremost for lack of foresight and ambition,the government for the ridiculous smoking ban and excessive tax on alcohol,social media for encouraging a stay at home culture.
Landlords too need to do more to bring people into pubs by offering incentives and regular activities and many do not and just blindly expect locals to turn up regardless but forget the pub and entertainment industry is a competitive one. Until the government,breweries and pub landlords reach a consensus,the pub trade will continue to die. Lower alcohol prices,relax the smoking ban,more brewery investment into pubs,more community activities,a national pub ban scheme for pub violence would all help. Sadly there is no hunger or desire it seems by those in power or in the brewing industry to save Britain's pub industry. Within a decade i suspect half the pubs in the UK will be gone and within 30 years 90 per cent will be gone.
Thwaites as said earlier are living in the past and their pubs are indeed tired and decaying in the main. The death of the pub industry is a national disgrace and shame and as a country we will regret in years to come,the passing of a powerhouse great industry. Who to blame? Breweries first and foremost for lack of foresight and ambition,the government for the ridiculous smoking ban and excessive tax on alcohol,social media for encouraging a stay at home culture. Landlords too need to do more to bring people into pubs by offering incentives and regular activities and many do not and just blindly expect locals to turn up regardless but forget the pub and entertainment industry is a competitive one. Until the government,breweries and pub landlords reach a consensus,the pub trade will continue to die. Lower alcohol prices,relax the smoking ban,more brewery investment into pubs,more community activities,a national pub ban scheme for pub violence would all help. Sadly there is no hunger or desire it seems by those in power or in the brewing industry to save Britain's pub industry. Within a decade i suspect half the pubs in the UK will be gone and within 30 years 90 per cent will be gone. Reality50
  • Score: 6

1:29pm Tue 24 Jun 14

Excluded again says...

Darren Aires wrote:
Thwaites don't care about beer or Blackburn and haven't done for as long as I remember. They are not alone though, many big pub companies have terrible work practices. Pubs are shutting left, right and centre and it is mainly the 'traditional' boozer' which is under threat. There are many reasons for this notably the nation's inexplicable lack of enthusiasm for socialising. It is a shame that a massive part of Britain's heritage is being lost and not enough people care. Politicians may not like to hear it but yes.....The old fashioned ale house is a big part of OUR HERITAGE. Unfortunately politicians are just as uncaring as the pub companies - until of course it affects their pockets.
Actually a lot of politicians do care about pubs. The All Party Parliamentary Pubs group is one of the largest voluntary groups of MPs in parliament. And they do a lot of work trying to get government to adopt policies more favourable to pubs. Just yesterday the group sponsored the launch in the House of Commons of a report into helping co-operative pubs which have successfully helped communities up and down the country save their pubs.

Unfortunately, they are up against one of the best established lobbying groups in the country - the pubcos and the big breweries. Lots of proposals which would have helped pubs have been withdrawn or watered down as a result of lobbying by these big companies.

On the other hand, where people do care they can save their pubs. There are dozens of pubs up and down the country which have been taken over by their communities and run very successfully.
[quote][p][bold]Darren Aires[/bold] wrote: Thwaites don't care about beer or Blackburn and haven't done for as long as I remember. They are not alone though, many big pub companies have terrible work practices. Pubs are shutting left, right and centre and it is mainly the 'traditional' boozer' which is under threat. There are many reasons for this notably the nation's inexplicable lack of enthusiasm for socialising. It is a shame that a massive part of Britain's heritage is being lost and not enough people care. Politicians may not like to hear it but yes.....The old fashioned ale house is a big part of OUR HERITAGE. Unfortunately politicians are just as uncaring as the pub companies - until of course it affects their pockets.[/p][/quote]Actually a lot of politicians do care about pubs. The All Party Parliamentary Pubs group is one of the largest voluntary groups of MPs in parliament. And they do a lot of work trying to get government to adopt policies more favourable to pubs. Just yesterday the group sponsored the launch in the House of Commons of a report into helping co-operative pubs which have successfully helped communities up and down the country save their pubs. Unfortunately, they are up against one of the best established lobbying groups in the country - the pubcos and the big breweries. Lots of proposals which would have helped pubs have been withdrawn or watered down as a result of lobbying by these big companies. On the other hand, where people do care they can save their pubs. There are dozens of pubs up and down the country which have been taken over by their communities and run very successfully. Excluded again
  • Score: 5

1:37pm Tue 24 Jun 14

hasslem hasslem says...

Darren Aires wrote:
Thwaites don't care about beer or Blackburn and haven't done for as long as I remember. They are not alone though, many big pub companies have terrible work practices. Pubs are shutting left, right and centre and it is mainly the 'traditional' boozer' which is under threat. There are many reasons for this notably the nation's inexplicable lack of enthusiasm for socialising. It is a shame that a massive part of Britain's heritage is being lost and not enough people care. Politicians may not like to hear it but yes.....The old fashioned ale house is a big part of OUR HERITAGE. Unfortunately politicians are just as uncaring as the pub companies - until of course it affects their pockets.
All of which is very true - but it does not explain why some pubs which retain the old fashioned traditional ale house can still make a do out of running a boozer.

granted there are a load of factors that have affected the ability to make money out of selling beer - but very high on the list (if not at the top) is greedy brewery business that converted themselves into property companies following the Beer Orders in the mid 90s.

Yes, there is stuff like smoking legislation, drink driving etc that have affected pubs but there has been massive changes in the way people manage their spare time - these days kids play on the x-box rather than down the local nags head playing snooker or pool....the move to wine and shots has not been reflected in most traditional pubs, mates gather round at other pals hoses to watch the match on a sunday afternoon etc etc.

there are pubs - town centre tradtional pubs that thrive - the bridge bier haus in burnley is the best example i can think of round here - an outstanding town centre boozer.....not in the slightest bit poncey - people in there from 16-80 having a good time chewing the fat. busy during the day and at night. now look at the location and you would say it is awful - but it does ok to me.
[quote][p][bold]Darren Aires[/bold] wrote: Thwaites don't care about beer or Blackburn and haven't done for as long as I remember. They are not alone though, many big pub companies have terrible work practices. Pubs are shutting left, right and centre and it is mainly the 'traditional' boozer' which is under threat. There are many reasons for this notably the nation's inexplicable lack of enthusiasm for socialising. It is a shame that a massive part of Britain's heritage is being lost and not enough people care. Politicians may not like to hear it but yes.....The old fashioned ale house is a big part of OUR HERITAGE. Unfortunately politicians are just as uncaring as the pub companies - until of course it affects their pockets.[/p][/quote]All of which is very true - but it does not explain why some pubs which retain the old fashioned traditional ale house can still make a do out of running a boozer. granted there are a load of factors that have affected the ability to make money out of selling beer - but very high on the list (if not at the top) is greedy brewery business that converted themselves into property companies following the Beer Orders in the mid 90s. Yes, there is stuff like smoking legislation, drink driving etc that have affected pubs but there has been massive changes in the way people manage their spare time - these days kids play on the x-box rather than down the local nags head playing snooker or pool....the move to wine and shots has not been reflected in most traditional pubs, mates gather round at other pals hoses to watch the match on a sunday afternoon etc etc. there are pubs - town centre tradtional pubs that thrive - the bridge bier haus in burnley is the best example i can think of round here - an outstanding town centre boozer.....not in the slightest bit poncey - people in there from 16-80 having a good time chewing the fat. busy during the day and at night. now look at the location and you would say it is awful - but it does ok to me. hasslem hasslem
  • Score: 8

3:44pm Tue 24 Jun 14

Openminded? says...

GracesDad wrote:
HelmshoreBoy wrote:
Openminded? wrote:
Shall we blame the Muslims for this? :)
What the hell is it to do with Muslims. Its a sign of the times. Things are tight.

You are a really feeble minded, bacon loving, sausage mother, pork chop sucker, individual rascist.

Openminded? More like narrowminded! Ar**hole!!
It's a running joke that you haven't been involved in. You've just made yourself look a right dick.
I was just going to say. Thanks GracesDad

That response made my day !
[quote][p][bold]GracesDad[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]HelmshoreBoy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Openminded?[/bold] wrote: Shall we blame the Muslims for this? :)[/p][/quote]What the hell is it to do with Muslims. Its a sign of the times. Things are tight. You are a really feeble minded, bacon loving, sausage mother, pork chop sucker, individual rascist. Openminded? More like narrowminded! Ar**hole!![/p][/quote]It's a running joke that you haven't been involved in. You've just made yourself look a right dick.[/p][/quote]I was just going to say. Thanks GracesDad That response made my day ! Openminded?
  • Score: 7

5:39pm Tue 24 Jun 14

phil kernot says...

The writing on the cooling tower said it all thwaites are txwats,lol
The writing on the cooling tower said it all thwaites are txwats,lol phil kernot
  • Score: 1

6:30am Wed 25 Jun 14

Batmonkey says...

Some very interesting points but the truth is pubs in Darwen are sharing a limited Market. They are not "thriving" many just exist. The opening of Werherspoons has merely centralised the customer base and the belief it has increased pub trade is a myth. All people do is stay there longer and go to Bridgwater later who in turn have such ridiculous offers on no one can compete. Thwaites business model has been to open eating establishments so can Darwen sustain another? I refer to the 2 previously mentioned pubs right next door to the Millstone which after 2 refurb is soulless and lacks identity so in my opinion will be next to close. The loss of The White Lion is the beginning and unfortunately may not be the last, too many pubs in a small local and only so many customers with only south money. Watch this space!
Some very interesting points but the truth is pubs in Darwen are sharing a limited Market. They are not "thriving" many just exist. The opening of Werherspoons has merely centralised the customer base and the belief it has increased pub trade is a myth. All people do is stay there longer and go to Bridgwater later who in turn have such ridiculous offers on no one can compete. Thwaites business model has been to open eating establishments so can Darwen sustain another? I refer to the 2 previously mentioned pubs right next door to the Millstone which after 2 refurb is soulless and lacks identity so in my opinion will be next to close. The loss of The White Lion is the beginning and unfortunately may not be the last, too many pubs in a small local and only so many customers with only south money. Watch this space! Batmonkey
  • Score: 1

6:33am Wed 25 Jun 14

Batmonkey says...

Batmonkey wrote:
Some very interesting points but the truth is pubs in Darwen are sharing a limited Market. They are not "thriving" many just exist. The opening of Werherspoons has merely centralised the customer base and the belief it has increased pub trade is a myth. All people do is stay there longer and go to Bridgwater later who in turn have such ridiculous offers on no one can compete. Thwaites business model has been to open eating establishments so can Darwen sustain another? I refer to the 2 previously mentioned pubs right next door to the Millstone which after 2 refurb is soulless and lacks identity so in my opinion will be next to close. The loss of The White Lion is the beginning and unfortunately may not be the last, too many pubs in a small local and only so many customers with only south money. Watch this space!
I meant so much money not south !!!!
[quote][p][bold]Batmonkey[/bold] wrote: Some very interesting points but the truth is pubs in Darwen are sharing a limited Market. They are not "thriving" many just exist. The opening of Werherspoons has merely centralised the customer base and the belief it has increased pub trade is a myth. All people do is stay there longer and go to Bridgwater later who in turn have such ridiculous offers on no one can compete. Thwaites business model has been to open eating establishments so can Darwen sustain another? I refer to the 2 previously mentioned pubs right next door to the Millstone which after 2 refurb is soulless and lacks identity so in my opinion will be next to close. The loss of The White Lion is the beginning and unfortunately may not be the last, too many pubs in a small local and only so many customers with only south money. Watch this space![/p][/quote]I meant so much money not south !!!! Batmonkey
  • Score: 0

8:46pm Wed 25 Jun 14

Real Ale Up North says...

Thwaites pub reviewed in my weekly column in Thursday's Telegraph . Sadly, it didn't come up to expectations. :-(
Thwaites pub reviewed in my weekly column in Thursday's Telegraph . Sadly, it didn't come up to expectations. :-( Real Ale Up North
  • Score: 0

5:24am Mon 30 Jun 14

Roverthere says...

hasslem hasslem wrote:
thwaites doesnt seem to give a monkey's chuff about its beer (moving production down to the Midlands), its pubs (see the a above story) or the town that made its fortune (combine the two).

Its a crying shame that what used to be a proud business is a shadow of its former self. as real ale up north says - look at the black bull at tockholes - it doesnt seem to be affected by the economy or the drink driving country pub debate. - look at moorhouses who are eating thwaites lunch (or drinking it) and finally look at darwen - pubs are actually opening in darwen...the night-time economy is actually thriving, for everybody except thwaites. two george pubs shut, brittania, cemetery, mill gap, white lion - there are a few which remain steadfast and the golden cup shows it can be done in a thwaites establishment.

thwaites regrettably through appalling management is a company and brand whose time has been and gone - the directors should hang their head in shame.

would you like a pint of smooth?
No THANKS! Real ale please!
[quote][p][bold]hasslem hasslem[/bold] wrote: thwaites doesnt seem to give a monkey's chuff about its beer (moving production down to the Midlands), its pubs (see the a above story) or the town that made its fortune (combine the two). Its a crying shame that what used to be a proud business is a shadow of its former self. as real ale up north says - look at the black bull at tockholes - it doesnt seem to be affected by the economy or the drink driving country pub debate. - look at moorhouses who are eating thwaites lunch (or drinking it) and finally look at darwen - pubs are actually opening in darwen...the night-time economy is actually thriving, for everybody except thwaites. two george pubs shut, brittania, cemetery, mill gap, white lion - there are a few which remain steadfast and the golden cup shows it can be done in a thwaites establishment. thwaites regrettably through appalling management is a company and brand whose time has been and gone - the directors should hang their head in shame. would you like a pint of smooth?[/p][/quote]No THANKS! Real ale please! Roverthere
  • Score: 0

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