In need of a 'God Particle for Dummies?

All they wanted for Christmas was the God Particle(GP).

Now, it looks as though the incredible scientists at Cern have found it.

It's shaping up to be as massive as Crick and Watson's DNA find or Fleming's penicillin.

For the inside lowdown, I emailed an old Accrington friend now working at CERN's Large Hadron Collider.

Here, a massive underground circular tunnel is used to smash millions of particles into each other to recreate mini 'creation' Big Bangs in which the Higgs boson, the posh scientific name for the GP, might reveal itself.

So far, my mate's more elusive than GP itself.

At least the Higgs boson, which exists for a billionth of an eye-blink, has had the courtesy to answer scientific enquiries by leaving a calling card the thing it decays into.

This starter particle of the universe signs the Universe's visitors book with a signature of two special photons.

Losing the thread? Like me? In need of a 'God Particle for Dummies?

Then log onto www.theregister.co.uk/2011/12/14/higgs_boson_deep_dive

For us mundane Saturday morning bacon-butty munchers, here's the point I'm labouring.

It seems that God breaks through to us only when we're ready for the next veil to be lifted on the exquisite truth of his universe.

Historically, God shows himself to us in two ways: through the Book of His Word 'the Bible and his Son who showed himself at that first Christmas (when ‘the Word became flesh', John 1); and secondly through the Book of his World nature's divine designs and delightful dazzlements.

This Christmas, perhaps God's loving gift to us is a new chapter, detailing the particle he used to start the universe and give everything its mass and content.

Happy Christmas!

Comments (60)

Please log in to enable comment sorting

9:15am Sat 17 Dec 11

Revkev says...

Hi folks,
The seventh paragraph above has lost it's dash. It should read...
xxxxxx
At least the Higgs boson, which exists for a billionth of an eye-blink, has had the courtesy to answer scientific enquiries by leaving a calling card - the thing it decays into.
Hi folks, The seventh paragraph above has lost it's dash. It should read... xxxxxx At least the Higgs boson, which exists for a billionth of an eye-blink, has had the courtesy to answer scientific enquiries by leaving a calling card - the thing it decays into. Revkev

9:20am Sat 17 Dec 11

Revkev says...

Me again.
The web site address didn't quite make it in tact. So, see below if interested...
XXXXXX
http://www.theregist
er.co.uk/2011/12/14/
higgs_boson_deep_div
e/
Me again. The web site address didn't quite make it in tact. So, see below if interested... XXXXXX http://www.theregist er.co.uk/2011/12/14/ higgs_boson_deep_div e/ Revkev

9:25am Sat 17 Dec 11

Revkev says...

And once more...
I've just noticed that making these two corrections has taken this column to the top of the "most read" league table.
So, I thought I'd add one more comment for vanity's sake.
Well, I don't top leagues very often.
And once more... I've just noticed that making these two corrections has taken this column to the top of the "most read" league table. So, I thought I'd add one more comment for vanity's sake. Well, I don't top leagues very often. Revkev

4:21pm Sat 17 Dec 11

Centaur says...

Not bad when you write to yourself, and then answer yourself.

In need of a head shrink Kev!
Not bad when you write to yourself, and then answer yourself. In need of a head shrink Kev! Centaur

4:25pm Sat 17 Dec 11

enki jr says...

The bible is not the word or words of
any god but the words of a freemason
called jimmy nesbit, (king james) and it
has been proven no doubt that some of the narrative wasnt even written by the people it represented, so when you mention this man god and his son
i can safely assume you are brainwashed with jew worship...
Rome was a pagan society, and was named SATURNIA beforehand, the vatican is a representative of every pagan cult and beleif merged into the
heretical worship of the yidd yeshua ben nazerath, (a legal fiction) if you are so knowledgable with truth then you would know this, and if you can name
ANY rite or ritual the vatican practices that isnt pagan origin
then i will give you credit, name one thing, just one that ISNT pagan......
The bible is not the word or words of any god but the words of a freemason called jimmy nesbit, (king james) and it has been proven no doubt that some of the narrative wasnt even written by the people it represented, so when you mention this man god and his son i can safely assume you are brainwashed with jew worship... Rome was a pagan society, and was named SATURNIA beforehand, the vatican is a representative of every pagan cult and beleif merged into the heretical worship of the yidd yeshua ben nazerath, (a legal fiction) if you are so knowledgable with truth then you would know this, and if you can name ANY rite or ritual the vatican practices that isnt pagan origin then i will give you credit, name one thing, just one that ISNT pagan...... enki jr

4:44pm Sat 17 Dec 11

brok says...

Sorry Kevin, the link (which I cut and pasted) led to an article from some bloke in the Telegraph.
During my search, my mind - as is its wont, took a detour to Richard Matheson's book "The Shrinking Man". That story began with a man who realised that his suit was suddenly a couple of sizes too big and ended with him looking forward to life with the fifties' equivalent of sub -atomic particles. Pure fiction of course, and Matheson never did explain how his hero managed to breath in oxygen and nitrogen atoms once he became too small to get them into his bronchi.
The parallel may seem a little obscure, but our eponymous hero's tale hangs at the point where the GP takes up the next chapter.
Now, there is a pretty good article with graphics at http://www.independe
nt.co.uk/news/scienc
e/has-science-found-
the-god-particle-627
6634.html which may throw some light on this beyond-my-brainpower subject.
In the meantime, I assume that we are on the evolution versus creation debate. If so we do not need to plough through posh newspaper or academic sites or even re-read Matheson, because both are mere catalysts in that debate.
Can we discover smaller and smaller particles, sub particles and even sub sub particles?
Will these discoveries prove the existence of a "God" or will we find that the "Wizard of Oz" was closer to the truth and we still put up altars to the unknown god just in case?
The Earth, according to science is approximately 4.5 billion years old mankind approximately 1.5 million years old, CERN's particle accelerator will not add anything to prove or disprove the argument because creation, evolution and big bang are not incompatible phenomena in philosophical argument.
Sorry Kevin, the link (which I cut and pasted) led to an article from some bloke in the Telegraph. During my search, my mind - as is its wont, took a detour to Richard Matheson's book "The Shrinking Man". That story began with a man who realised that his suit was suddenly a couple of sizes too big and ended with him looking forward to life with the fifties' equivalent of sub -atomic particles. Pure fiction of course, and Matheson never did explain how his hero managed to breath in oxygen and nitrogen atoms once he became too small to get them into his bronchi. The parallel may seem a little obscure, but our eponymous hero's tale hangs at the point where the GP takes up the next chapter. Now, there is a pretty good article with graphics at http://www.independe nt.co.uk/news/scienc e/has-science-found- the-god-particle-627 6634.html which may throw some light on this beyond-my-brainpower subject. In the meantime, I assume that we are on the evolution versus creation debate. If so we do not need to plough through posh newspaper or academic sites or even re-read Matheson, because both are mere catalysts in that debate. Can we discover smaller and smaller particles, sub particles and even sub sub particles? Will these discoveries prove the existence of a "God" or will we find that the "Wizard of Oz" was closer to the truth and we still put up altars to the unknown god just in case? The Earth, according to science is approximately 4.5 billion years old mankind approximately 1.5 million years old, CERN's particle accelerator will not add anything to prove or disprove the argument because creation, evolution and big bang are not incompatible phenomena in philosophical argument. brok

4:57pm Sat 17 Dec 11

brok says...

Enki jr said:
"The bible is not the word or words of
any god but the words of a freemason
called jimmy nesbit, (king james) and it
has been proven no doubt that some of the narrative wasnt even written by the people it represented, so when you mention this man god and his son
i can safely assume you are brainwashed with jew worship..."

Wow, we ARE delving into the archives with this one!
James I and VI (1566 - 1625). Can you explain to me how Thomas Cranmer's Book of Common Prayer, first edition, containing long and complicated tables of BIBLE readings, was dated 1554 twelve years before James was born? If you must put up an argument Just because it is getting close to Christmas, we don't have to consume all chestnuts laid before us.
If you use the word 'proven' (or the English 'proved') you must be prepared to produce the empirical evidence, with dates of research to back it up and the names of the researchers otherwise 'proof' is only conjecture..
Enki jr said: "The bible is not the word or words of any god but the words of a freemason called jimmy nesbit, (king james) and it has been proven no doubt that some of the narrative wasnt even written by the people it represented, so when you mention this man god and his son i can safely assume you are brainwashed with jew worship..." Wow, we ARE delving into the archives with this one! James I and VI (1566 - 1625). Can you explain to me how Thomas Cranmer's Book of Common Prayer, first edition, containing long and complicated tables of BIBLE readings, was dated 1554 twelve years before James was born? If you must put up an argument Just because it is getting close to Christmas, we don't have to consume all chestnuts laid before us. If you use the word 'proven' (or the English 'proved') you must be prepared to produce the empirical evidence, with dates of research to back it up and the names of the researchers otherwise 'proof' is only conjecture.. brok

5:21pm Sat 17 Dec 11

brok says...

By the way, did I detect a small note of anti-Semitism, Enki jr?
By the way, did I detect a small note of anti-Semitism, Enki jr? brok

5:53pm Sat 17 Dec 11

Revkev says...

Centaur wrote:
Not bad when you write to yourself, and then answer yourself.

In need of a head shrink Kev!
Hi Centaur :-
You offering?
I'm sure you could heal my odd sense of humour.
[quote][p][bold]Centaur[/bold] wrote: Not bad when you write to yourself, and then answer yourself. In need of a head shrink Kev![/p][/quote]Hi Centaur :- You offering? I'm sure you could heal my odd sense of humour. Revkev

12:18am Sun 18 Dec 11

ToffeeGuy says...

God shows himself to us..... through the Book of his World nature's divine designs and delightful dazzlements.

Like earthquakes, flood, famine and tsunamis which usually hit the poorest hardest. Perhaps God should call off his show.
God shows himself to us..... through the Book of his World nature's divine designs and delightful dazzlements. Like earthquakes, flood, famine and tsunamis which usually hit the poorest hardest. Perhaps God should call off his show. ToffeeGuy

11:48am Sun 18 Dec 11

brok says...

Toffee Guy wrote:
"Like earthquakes, flood, famine and tsunamis which usually hit the poorest hardest. Perhaps God should call off his show."

The fact that the poorest are hit hardest by geological and meteorological disasters is more to do with the socio-economic conditions that prevail in a world where there are almost seven billion people.
Humanity is history's most successful parasite, exploiting taking and corrupting in and from every point.
The tsunami of 2004 killed an estimated 150,000 or 0.00215% of the world's population. Worldwide Mission states that, globally, there are 360,000 live births every day almost twice the death rate. The tragic dead of the tsunami were replaced in one day.

Famine, flood and other disasters occur often because of the poorer people being forced to live on land vulnerable to these phenomena. The flood deaths and hardship of Pakistan are an annual event in an area similar to the flood plains of the Nile. These floods are as essential to the ecosystems as carbon dioxide is to the survival of the world as a whole and yet both floods and carbon dioxide are seen as modern evils.
Ask the Punjab area of India about famine because global companies (Rice Tec) persuaded them to give up their subsistence farming methods and grow hybrid rice. The result mass suicides of Punjabi farmers (look up Vandana Shiva Reece Lectures for a distressing account given with clarity and dignity by Dr Shiva).

So, don't blame a god for humanity's shortcomings. As a species, we are greedy, rapacious, destructive and myopic.
Here's a thought; there are, as stated almost 7,000,000000 humans in this world and only 3,948 tigers, or 177,3049 humans for every tiger.
Toffee Guy wrote: "Like earthquakes, flood, famine and tsunamis which usually hit the poorest hardest. Perhaps God should call off his show." The fact that the poorest are hit hardest by geological and meteorological disasters is more to do with the socio-economic conditions that prevail in a world where there are almost seven billion people. Humanity is history's most successful parasite, exploiting taking and corrupting in and from every point. The tsunami of 2004 killed an estimated 150,000 or 0.00215% of the world's population. Worldwide Mission states that, globally, there are 360,000 live births every day almost twice the death rate. The tragic dead of the tsunami were replaced in one day. Famine, flood and other disasters occur often because of the poorer people being forced to live on land vulnerable to these phenomena. The flood deaths and hardship of Pakistan are an annual event in an area similar to the flood plains of the Nile. These floods are as essential to the ecosystems as carbon dioxide is to the survival of the world as a whole and yet both floods and carbon dioxide are seen as modern evils. Ask the Punjab area of India about famine because global companies (Rice Tec) persuaded them to give up their subsistence farming methods and grow hybrid rice. The result mass suicides of Punjabi farmers (look up Vandana Shiva Reece Lectures for a distressing account given with clarity and dignity by Dr Shiva). So, don't blame a god for humanity's shortcomings. As a species, we are greedy, rapacious, destructive and myopic. Here's a thought; there are, as stated almost 7,000,000000 humans in this world and only 3,948 tigers, or 177,3049 humans for every tiger. brok

11:54am Sun 18 Dec 11

brok says...

Typo Reith Lectures (Radio 4) not Reece, sorry!
Typo Reith Lectures (Radio 4) not Reece, sorry! brok

10:38pm Sun 18 Dec 11

Revkev says...

brok wrote:
Sorry Kevin, the link (which I cut and pasted) led to an article from some bloke in the Telegraph.
During my search, my mind - as is its wont, took a detour to Richard Matheson's book "The Shrinking Man". That story began with a man who realised that his suit was suddenly a couple of sizes too big and ended with him looking forward to life with the fifties' equivalent of sub -atomic particles. Pure fiction of course, and Matheson never did explain how his hero managed to breath in oxygen and nitrogen atoms once he became too small to get them into his bronchi.
The parallel may seem a little obscure, but our eponymous hero's tale hangs at the point where the GP takes up the next chapter.
Now, there is a pretty good article with graphics at http://www.independe

nt.co.uk/news/scienc

e/has-science-found-

the-god-particle-627

6634.html which may throw some light on this beyond-my-brainpower subject.
In the meantime, I assume that we are on the evolution versus creation debate. If so we do not need to plough through posh newspaper or academic sites or even re-read Matheson, because both are mere catalysts in that debate.
Can we discover smaller and smaller particles, sub particles and even sub sub particles?
Will these discoveries prove the existence of a "God" or will we find that the "Wizard of Oz" was closer to the truth and we still put up altars to the unknown god just in case?
The Earth, according to science is approximately 4.5 billion years old mankind approximately 1.5 million years old, CERN's particle accelerator will not add anything to prove or disprove the argument because creation, evolution and big bang are not incompatible phenomena in philosophical argument.
Hi Brok,
Don't worry. I'm not thinking of the creation/evolution debate.
I'm simply marvelling at brilliant minds, great discoveries while getting in a big hint that there's a Creator.
I'm not trying to suggest (at least this week) how God created.
'
Sorry the link didn't work. I'll have a look at yours when I get time.
.
I chuckled at the story.
I was reminded of the film of shrinking a spy/medical team in a submarine which was then inserted into a dying spy to save his life... the Incredible Journey, or something.
I never jumped to the rather obvious thought they'd be too tiny to take in air molecules.
I never let a practical detail get in the way of a cracking good yarn.
[quote][p][bold]brok[/bold] wrote: Sorry Kevin, the link (which I cut and pasted) led to an article from some bloke in the Telegraph. During my search, my mind - as is its wont, took a detour to Richard Matheson's book "The Shrinking Man". That story began with a man who realised that his suit was suddenly a couple of sizes too big and ended with him looking forward to life with the fifties' equivalent of sub -atomic particles. Pure fiction of course, and Matheson never did explain how his hero managed to breath in oxygen and nitrogen atoms once he became too small to get them into his bronchi. The parallel may seem a little obscure, but our eponymous hero's tale hangs at the point where the GP takes up the next chapter. Now, there is a pretty good article with graphics at http://www.independe nt.co.uk/news/scienc e/has-science-found- the-god-particle-627 6634.html which may throw some light on this beyond-my-brainpower subject. In the meantime, I assume that we are on the evolution versus creation debate. If so we do not need to plough through posh newspaper or academic sites or even re-read Matheson, because both are mere catalysts in that debate. Can we discover smaller and smaller particles, sub particles and even sub sub particles? Will these discoveries prove the existence of a "God" or will we find that the "Wizard of Oz" was closer to the truth and we still put up altars to the unknown god just in case? The Earth, according to science is approximately 4.5 billion years old mankind approximately 1.5 million years old, CERN's particle accelerator will not add anything to prove or disprove the argument because creation, evolution and big bang are not incompatible phenomena in philosophical argument.[/p][/quote]Hi Brok, Don't worry. I'm not thinking of the creation/evolution debate. I'm simply marvelling at brilliant minds, great discoveries while getting in a big hint that there's a Creator. I'm not trying to suggest (at least this week) how God created. ' Sorry the link didn't work. I'll have a look at yours when I get time. . I chuckled at the story. I was reminded of the film of shrinking a spy/medical team in a submarine which was then inserted into a dying spy to save his life... the Incredible Journey, or something. I never jumped to the rather obvious thought they'd be too tiny to take in air molecules. I never let a practical detail get in the way of a cracking good yarn. Revkev

11:18pm Sun 18 Dec 11

brok says...

Thank you for that, Kevin, forgive me for trying to read your mind!
Plus magazine at: http://plus.maths.or
g/content/lhc-dummie
s
Has an excellent article from which I quote.
"Why does it do it?

To answer some of the mysteries of the Universe. Physicists think that everything began around 13.7 billion years ago with the Big Bang. Back then the Universe was incredibly hot and dense. But in an instant it started to cool down and the various processes that gave rise to everything we see today sprung into action".

This, judging by your sub title, is an article you have seen. So I paste it for the benefit of those who had trouble with the other links.
It is interesting, I agree, I am led to conjecture about what made up the 'density' was the light created able to carry sub - atomic particles at 186,000 miles a second or was it the impetus of the 'bang' itself and if this was the case, was there some sort of cosmic super glue to bind all these s.a.p 's together to form the basis of planets.
Does that mean that all the planets are exactly the same age and given that the vastness of space is an alleged vacuum, what influenced the diversity of atmospheres - why do all planets not support life?
Thank goodness my degree was in social science I think natural science would leave me floundering!
Now, there is a subject for debate: "Space has no boundaries, discuss."
Thank you for that, Kevin, forgive me for trying to read your mind! Plus magazine at: http://plus.maths.or g/content/lhc-dummie s Has an excellent article from which I quote. "Why does it do it? To answer some of the mysteries of the Universe. Physicists think that everything began around 13.7 billion years ago with the Big Bang. Back then the Universe was incredibly hot and dense. But in an instant it started to cool down and the various processes that gave rise to everything we see today sprung into action". This, judging by your sub title, is an article you have seen. So I paste it for the benefit of those who had trouble with the other links. It is interesting, I agree, I am led to conjecture about what made up the 'density' was the light created able to carry sub - atomic particles at 186,000 miles a second or was it the impetus of the 'bang' itself and if this was the case, was there some sort of cosmic super glue to bind all these s.a.p 's together to form the basis of planets. Does that mean that all the planets are exactly the same age and given that the vastness of space is an alleged vacuum, what influenced the diversity of atmospheres - why do all planets not support life? Thank goodness my degree was in social science I think natural science would leave me floundering! Now, there is a subject for debate: "Space has no boundaries, discuss." brok

8:45am Mon 19 Dec 11

Joseph Yossarian says...

RK says

""I never let a practical detail get in the way of a cracking good yarn.""

For once a true word spoken..............
......
RK says ""I never let a practical detail get in the way of a cracking good yarn."" For once a true word spoken.............. ...... Joseph Yossarian

11:51am Mon 19 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

What form of LIFE can be discovered without a breath and what breath can be discovered without a human life to discover it.?


This planetary particle is the LEAST HOSTILE of all the planets to be on if you are a human being and I call that an act of Kindness in itself.


What us is an ocean of love, without a lover to enjoy it.

.

I think you will find regardless of every scientific research you can come up with that A BREATH of love, A Breath of life, and probably a Breath of air too can in reality pass through the eye of most needles.
What form of LIFE can be discovered without a breath and what breath can be discovered without a human life to discover it.? This planetary particle is the LEAST HOSTILE of all the planets to be on if you are a human being and I call that an act of Kindness in itself. What us is an ocean of love, without a lover to enjoy it. . I think you will find regardless of every scientific research you can come up with that A BREATH of love, A Breath of life, and probably a Breath of air too can in reality pass through the eye of most needles. Ken Shuffles

11:56am Mon 19 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

Of all the atmospheres in this universe, it should make us thankful to learn that there is one atmosphere we have been given that is not even made out of hurt.
Of all the atmospheres in this universe, it should make us thankful to learn that there is one atmosphere we have been given that is not even made out of hurt. Ken Shuffles

3:05pm Mon 19 Dec 11

Joseph Yossarian says...

brok wrote:
Enki jr said: "The bible is not the word or words of any god but the words of a freemason called jimmy nesbit, (king james) and it has been proven no doubt that some of the narrative wasnt even written by the people it represented, so when you mention this man god and his son i can safely assume you are brainwashed with jew worship..." Wow, we ARE delving into the archives with this one! James I and VI (1566 - 1625). Can you explain to me how Thomas Cranmer's Book of Common Prayer, first edition, containing long and complicated tables of BIBLE readings, was dated 1554 twelve years before James was born? If you must put up an argument Just because it is getting close to Christmas, we don't have to consume all chestnuts laid before us. If you use the word 'proven' (or the English 'proved') you must be prepared to produce the empirical evidence, with dates of research to back it up and the names of the researchers otherwise 'proof' is only conjecture..
For all who are interested, the current months National Geographic magazine has an excellent article on the history of the King James bible.

Highly recommended, and that's from a non-religious type.
[quote][p][bold]brok[/bold] wrote: Enki jr said: "The bible is not the word or words of any god but the words of a freemason called jimmy nesbit, (king james) and it has been proven no doubt that some of the narrative wasnt even written by the people it represented, so when you mention this man god and his son i can safely assume you are brainwashed with jew worship..." Wow, we ARE delving into the archives with this one! James I and VI (1566 - 1625). Can you explain to me how Thomas Cranmer's Book of Common Prayer, first edition, containing long and complicated tables of BIBLE readings, was dated 1554 twelve years before James was born? If you must put up an argument Just because it is getting close to Christmas, we don't have to consume all chestnuts laid before us. If you use the word 'proven' (or the English 'proved') you must be prepared to produce the empirical evidence, with dates of research to back it up and the names of the researchers otherwise 'proof' is only conjecture..[/p][/quote]For all who are interested, the current months National Geographic magazine has an excellent article on the history of the King James bible. Highly recommended, and that's from a non-religious type. Joseph Yossarian

4:37pm Mon 19 Dec 11

Carlost says...

Hi Revkev

I know you are exited that scientists are looking for the "God Particle" but! they could just as well have called it the Dog particle, Cat particle or even the "Higgs Boson" ( after a Scotsman I do believe ). The effect they are trying to observe has nothing to do with your or anyone elses god and certainly has no relevance to the Bible or any other book of invented stories ( other than to expalin the matter they comprise of). I know people like you try to make these ridiculous links to proper scientific understanding of the world but you are just fooling yourselves and being dishonest with others. Just enjoy the wonder of the Scientific Method for what it is, and rejoice at the Intellect of the Human species, amen.
Hi Revkev I know you are exited that scientists are looking for the "God Particle" but! they could just as well have called it the Dog particle, Cat particle or even the "Higgs Boson" ( after a Scotsman I do believe ). The effect they are trying to observe has nothing to do with your or anyone elses god and certainly has no relevance to the Bible or any other book of invented stories ( other than to expalin the matter they comprise of). I know people like you try to make these ridiculous links to proper scientific understanding of the world but you are just fooling yourselves and being dishonest with others. Just enjoy the wonder of the Scientific Method for what it is, and rejoice at the Intellect of the Human species, amen. Carlost

5:22pm Mon 19 Dec 11

enki jr says...

"By the way, did I detect a small note of anti-Semitism, Enki jr?”

logic and assumption are mental disabitlies and if one cannot overide
the logic it can cause a fatal error ... anti-semite ..no ..anti zionism...yes ... jew worship is herecy because there
is no singular son of god, we can all become "christs" as long as the ritual of annionting is done .The perverters of truth..the vatican switched
annionting to baptism ..baptism with fire and baptism with water, two
meaningless pagan rituals ....The very word CHRIST means the annionted one, it isnt a specific name given to a specific jew, its generic for anyone who has been annointed with the mixture of 6 quarts of olive oil, and various fragrant herbs inc 6 pounds of
kaneh-bosem, otherwise known as cannabis ... The body would absorb this through osmosis and only people annionted can be true christians wereas people baptised by the vatican are unknowingly accepting a pagan ritual of baal worship...
baal is a personification of the SUN.. hence the sun of god ...
add this to the ancient babylonian pagan ritual of idol worship in the form of a mother and child figure which predates the plaegerised madonna and child con by at least 3000 yrs, in fact the mother and child idol was used by many many races inc ancient britain well before the romans invaded, and i can assure you it did not symbolise any jew. coincidently the jews idolised a mother and child figure and if you have the focus to thoroughly reseach what is being said, then you will understand how this idol became specifically a jew .this is why the ignorant can accuse others of anti-semitism while the zionists who hide behind the cloak of the jew get away with mass murder, the drugging
of food and water supplies and the privatisation of all property and utilities ...The real name for this time of year is YULETIDE ...calling it christmas means you are infected with jew worship...yuletide eve is called "mothers night" and the sons day is on the 25 dec ...and it has nothing to do with the birth of an annionted jew called yeshua ...
its funny that if one mentions the word jew its automatically assumed one is an anti-semite,
but the same logic doesnt apply if one says christian muslim hindu etc etc ....

And i issue a challenge to any so called pagan/christian to name any doctrine or rite in your fake religion of jew worship which isnt pagan ...and in order to be a REAL christian you have to have been ANNIONTED, not baptised in the name of baal....
much of creation is hidden and mystical due to our default setting known as sobriety, its there for a good reason, and no-matter how intoxicated you get, you
can always return to it, by default. Please dont assume i am an atheist, i consider myself more connected to all that there is than most people, and i refuse point blank to beleive in this man made evil called monatheism who portrays thier god as a vile destructive
idiot who creates his so-called best creature, then systematically goes about making the creature suffer and then burns them in hell forever ... christians are brainwashed heretics ...
p.s. The big bang to which society beleives started this universe simply did not happen, sir fred hoyle coined the term as a sarcastic rebuke and it has stuck ever since. sir fred
actually opposed this idea right up to his death, the universe expanded,not expoded.
and have you wondered why the CERT people are doing this? I can guarantee it wont be for the benefit of the human race, more the opposite. follow the money/sponsor trail ....
"By the way, did I detect a small note of anti-Semitism, Enki jr?” logic and assumption are mental disabitlies and if one cannot overide the logic it can cause a fatal error ... anti-semite ..no ..anti zionism...yes ... jew worship is herecy because there is no singular son of god, we can all become "christs" as long as the ritual of annionting is done .The perverters of truth..the vatican switched annionting to baptism ..baptism with fire and baptism with water, two meaningless pagan rituals ....The very word CHRIST means the annionted one, it isnt a specific name given to a specific jew, its generic for anyone who has been annointed with the mixture of 6 quarts of olive oil, and various fragrant herbs inc 6 pounds of kaneh-bosem, otherwise known as cannabis ... The body would absorb this through osmosis and only people annionted can be true christians wereas people baptised by the vatican are unknowingly accepting a pagan ritual of baal worship... baal is a personification of the SUN.. hence the sun of god ... add this to the ancient babylonian pagan ritual of idol worship in the form of a mother and child figure which predates the plaegerised madonna and child con by at least 3000 yrs, in fact the mother and child idol was used by many many races inc ancient britain well before the romans invaded, and i can assure you it did not symbolise any jew. coincidently the jews idolised a mother and child figure and if you have the focus to thoroughly reseach what is being said, then you will understand how this idol became specifically a jew .this is why the ignorant can accuse others of anti-semitism while the zionists who hide behind the cloak of the jew get away with mass murder, the drugging of food and water supplies and the privatisation of all property and utilities ...The real name for this time of year is YULETIDE ...calling it christmas means you are infected with jew worship...yuletide eve is called "mothers night" and the sons day is on the 25 dec ...and it has nothing to do with the birth of an annionted jew called yeshua ... its funny that if one mentions the word jew its automatically assumed one is an anti-semite, but the same logic doesnt apply if one says christian muslim hindu etc etc .... And i issue a challenge to any so called pagan/christian to name any doctrine or rite in your fake religion of jew worship which isnt pagan ...and in order to be a REAL christian you have to have been ANNIONTED, not baptised in the name of baal.... much of creation is hidden and mystical due to our default setting known as sobriety, its there for a good reason, and no-matter how intoxicated you get, you can always return to it, by default. Please dont assume i am an atheist, i consider myself more connected to all that there is than most people, and i refuse point blank to beleive in this man made evil called monatheism who portrays thier god as a vile destructive idiot who creates his so-called best creature, then systematically goes about making the creature suffer and then burns them in hell forever ... christians are brainwashed heretics ... p.s. The big bang to which society beleives started this universe simply did not happen, sir fred hoyle coined the term as a sarcastic rebuke and it has stuck ever since. sir fred actually opposed this idea right up to his death, the universe expanded,not expoded. and have you wondered why the CERT people are doing this? I can guarantee it wont be for the benefit of the human race, more the opposite. follow the money/sponsor trail .... enki jr

6:29pm Mon 19 Dec 11

DJ_Jaybee says...

The physicists at CERN will find what they call the 'Higgs Boson' but then be disappointed again when it doesn't weigh what their current physics model predicts.

This is because the model of the universe they are peddling is totally incomplete and they currently have to use 2 different and incompatible physics models to try to explain things (Newtonian and Quantum). Then they will want to build an even larger CERN to try to find an even smaller particle to try and reveal the missing piece.

Anyone who has studied any of the main ancient wisdom teachings will know that the exact formula is explained in detail - and was widely known, all around the world - evidence being found at all most ancient sites, even encoded in the buildings and exact locations that they chose.

They had an in-depth knowledge of what today's physicists have been looking for - and the fractal nature of the universe means they will just have to keep having to look at smaller and smaller particles - to infinity - before they finally admit their physics model is incorrect.

They would be better spending time familiarising themselves with the number system 0, 1-9 and learning about the geometry of the universe rather than wasting 5 billion dollars on something that is only going to raise more questions than is answers.

Suckers.
The physicists at CERN will find what they call the 'Higgs Boson' but then be disappointed again when it doesn't weigh what their current physics model predicts. This is because the model of the universe they are peddling is totally incomplete and they currently have to use 2 different and incompatible physics models to try to explain things (Newtonian and Quantum). Then they will want to build an even larger CERN to try to find an even smaller particle to try and reveal the missing piece. Anyone who has studied any of the main ancient wisdom teachings will know that the exact formula is explained in detail - and was widely known, all around the world - evidence being found at all most ancient sites, even encoded in the buildings and exact locations that they chose. They had an in-depth knowledge of what today's physicists have been looking for - and the fractal nature of the universe means they will just have to keep having to look at smaller and smaller particles - to infinity - before they finally admit their physics model is incorrect. They would be better spending time familiarising themselves with the number system 0, 1-9 and learning about the geometry of the universe rather than wasting 5 billion dollars on something that is only going to raise more questions than is answers. Suckers. DJ_Jaybee

8:24pm Mon 19 Dec 11

brok says...

Enki Jr Said
much of creation is hidden and mystical due to our default setting known as sobriety, its there for a good reason, and no-matter how intoxicated you get, you can always return to it, by default."

Ah! I see.
Enki Jr Said much of creation is hidden and mystical due to our default setting known as sobriety, its there for a good reason, and no-matter how intoxicated you get, you can always return to it, by default." Ah! I see. brok

9:24pm Mon 19 Dec 11

brok says...

Thank you Joe. I wasn't aware of that, guess where my eyes will be for the next couple of hours!
Thanks again.
Many people believe that the first bible in modern English was that produced in the sixties, but this is not so. Over a fifty year period, a man by the name of Ferrar Fenton translated the whole of the Bible into modern English and much of what he wrote makes sense of the somewhat archaic language. For instance, in Gen 1:1 he wrote "By periods, God created that which produced the solar systems then that which produced the Earth.
But the Earth was disorganised and empty; and darkness covered its convulsed waters."
There are mistakes and worries in the NEB; for example Luke 2:50 "Did you not know that I was bound to be in my Father's house?"
The King James version renders it correctly as " Wist ye not that I would be about my Father's business."
The greek word for house is "oikos" the greek rendering of this verse is "oti en tois tou patros mou dei enai me - that in the affairs of my father it behoves me to be. No 'oikos'!.. I state this to suggest that many important theological points can be lost in translation the one stated shows a difference between a mere description of location and an awareness of himself and his future.
The King James version was intended to avoid such mistakes and although not perfect, it has withstood the test of time.
Thank you Joe. I wasn't aware of that, guess where my eyes will be for the next couple of hours! Thanks again. Many people believe that the first bible in modern English was that produced in the sixties, but this is not so. Over a fifty year period, a man by the name of Ferrar Fenton translated the whole of the Bible into modern English and much of what he wrote makes sense of the somewhat archaic language. For instance, in Gen 1:1 he wrote "By periods, God created that which produced the solar systems then that which produced the Earth. But the Earth was disorganised and empty; and darkness covered its convulsed waters." There are mistakes and worries in the NEB; for example Luke 2:50 "Did you not know that I was bound to be in my Father's house?" The King James version renders it correctly as " Wist ye not that I would be about my Father's business." The greek word for house is "oikos" the greek rendering of this verse is "oti en tois tou patros mou dei enai me - that in the affairs of my father it behoves me to be. No 'oikos'!.. I state this to suggest that many important theological points can be lost in translation the one stated shows a difference between a mere description of location and an awareness of himself and his future. The King James version was intended to avoid such mistakes and although not perfect, it has withstood the test of time. brok

10:35pm Mon 19 Dec 11

Graham Hartley says...

DJ_Jaybee wrote:
The physicists at CERN will find what they call the 'Higgs Boson' but then be disappointed again when it doesn't weigh what their current physics model predicts.

This is because the model of the universe they are peddling is totally incomplete and they currently have to use 2 different and incompatible physics models to try to explain things (Newtonian and Quantum). Then they will want to build an even larger CERN to try to find an even smaller particle to try and reveal the missing piece.

Anyone who has studied any of the main ancient wisdom teachings will know that the exact formula is explained in detail - and was widely known, all around the world - evidence being found at all most ancient sites, even encoded in the buildings and exact locations that they chose.

They had an in-depth knowledge of what today's physicists have been looking for - and the fractal nature of the universe means they will just have to keep having to look at smaller and smaller particles - to infinity - before they finally admit their physics model is incorrect.

They would be better spending time familiarising themselves with the number system 0, 1-9 and learning about the geometry of the universe rather than wasting 5 billion dollars on something that is only going to raise more questions than is answers.

Suckers.
DJ, please consider rewriting this with less physics and more insults. It will be funnier.
[quote][p][bold]DJ_Jaybee[/bold] wrote: The physicists at CERN will find what they call the 'Higgs Boson' but then be disappointed again when it doesn't weigh what their current physics model predicts. This is because the model of the universe they are peddling is totally incomplete and they currently have to use 2 different and incompatible physics models to try to explain things (Newtonian and Quantum). Then they will want to build an even larger CERN to try to find an even smaller particle to try and reveal the missing piece. Anyone who has studied any of the main ancient wisdom teachings will know that the exact formula is explained in detail - and was widely known, all around the world - evidence being found at all most ancient sites, even encoded in the buildings and exact locations that they chose. They had an in-depth knowledge of what today's physicists have been looking for - and the fractal nature of the universe means they will just have to keep having to look at smaller and smaller particles - to infinity - before they finally admit their physics model is incorrect. They would be better spending time familiarising themselves with the number system 0, 1-9 and learning about the geometry of the universe rather than wasting 5 billion dollars on something that is only going to raise more questions than is answers. Suckers.[/p][/quote]DJ, please consider rewriting this with less physics and more insults. It will be funnier. Graham Hartley

12:35am Tue 20 Dec 11

brok says...

DJ Jaybee wrote:

"Anyone who has studied any of the main ancient wisdom teachings will know that the exact formula is explained in detail - and was widely known, all around the world - evidence being found at all most ancient sites, even encoded in the buildings and exact locations that they chose".
Why do people assume that antiquity is equal to authenticity.
Paganism is seen through rose tinted glasses, borrowing an aura of magic perceived by the credulous of the time, woven into lore and legend and served up as the example we have here.
What next? Jesus came in a space ship?
Lonely old women were burned at the stake because they had a knowledge of herbs and cures and the ignorant thought they were magic and witches. "The ancients left signs and portents - everybody knows that", who is everybody. Is it not strange that there is no research that support this assertion?
The Mayans and the Aztecs had their diagrams, calendars and signs. They also had an evil regime based upon human sacrifice of their own people and of their enemies. They were not magic but they were successful manipulators of a whole civilisation.
Religion and superstition have been used in this way since mankind first imagined gods and invented them.
DJ Jaybee wrote: "Anyone who has studied any of the main ancient wisdom teachings will know that the exact formula is explained in detail - and was widely known, all around the world - evidence being found at all most ancient sites, even encoded in the buildings and exact locations that they chose". Why do people assume that antiquity is equal to authenticity. Paganism is seen through rose tinted glasses, borrowing an aura of magic perceived by the credulous of the time, woven into lore and legend and served up as the example we have here. What next? Jesus came in a space ship? Lonely old women were burned at the stake because they had a knowledge of herbs and cures and the ignorant thought they were magic and witches. "The ancients left signs and portents - everybody knows that", who is everybody. Is it not strange that there is no research that support this assertion? The Mayans and the Aztecs had their diagrams, calendars and signs. They also had an evil regime based upon human sacrifice of their own people and of their enemies. They were not magic but they were successful manipulators of a whole civilisation. Religion and superstition have been used in this way since mankind first imagined gods and invented them. brok

1:03am Tue 20 Dec 11

enki jr says...

brok says... "Ah! I see.”

assumption or sarcasm?
brok says... "Ah! I see.” assumption or sarcasm? enki jr

9:51am Tue 20 Dec 11

brok says...

Irony, enki jr.

Perhaps an apposite quotation could come from Friedrich Nietzsche
(pronounced: Neetcher).
"It is the mark of a higher culture to value the little unpretentious truths which have been discovered by means of rigorous method more highly than those errors handed down by metaphysical ages and men, which blind us and make us happy." (Trans: Hollingdale).
Irony, enki jr. Perhaps an apposite quotation could come from Friedrich Nietzsche (pronounced: Neetcher). "It is the mark of a higher culture to value the little unpretentious truths which have been discovered by means of rigorous method more highly than those errors handed down by metaphysical ages and men, which blind us and make us happy." (Trans: Hollingdale). brok

9:56am Tue 20 Dec 11

DJ_Jaybee says...

Yep... numbers have been around a long time... and aren't man made only the names civilisations decide to give them.

They would be better understanding universal truths / constants like the number system and the properties of each and how geometry manifests in nature which was obviously more understood by the ancients than the dudes at CERN.

It doesn't matter whether you give numbers a god name, angel name, or cream cake name as long as they understand what the numbers represent in nature which is what they are trying to define by searching for the "god particle".

The energy companies have a lot of money riding on the current physics model being incorrect. So they aren't going to advertising how the answer has been known even in the earliest civilisations we've discovered.

Get them to explain the effects of the number 9 and notice that they will look puzzled. At that point you'll know they are still on a wild goose chase.

Probably best to not even mention geometry.

Just keep paying your bills. The 'scientists' are working on it - they've 'nearly' cracked it... yeah right.
Yep... numbers have been around a long time... and aren't man made only the names civilisations decide to give them. They would be better understanding universal truths / constants like the number system and the properties of each and how geometry manifests in nature which was obviously more understood by the ancients than the dudes at CERN. It doesn't matter whether you give numbers a god name, angel name, or cream cake name as long as they understand what the numbers represent in nature which is what they are trying to define by searching for the "god particle". The energy companies have a lot of money riding on the current physics model being incorrect. So they aren't going to advertising how the answer has been known even in the earliest civilisations we've discovered. Get them to explain the effects of the number 9 and notice that they will look puzzled. At that point you'll know they are still on a wild goose chase. Probably best to not even mention geometry. Just keep paying your bills. The 'scientists' are working on it - they've 'nearly' cracked it... yeah right. DJ_Jaybee

11:14am Tue 20 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

When any person is thankful for their human condition that is when the Divine condition shows up.


.


Nothing else, NOTHING less, and certainly no amount of Gods, nor any amount of religions, particles, or any of the arts and sciences will unlock the truth of the divine condition.


Nothing more than YOUR own appropriate feeling for your own human condition, will unlock THE true condition of the Divine.


No one else can do that for your human condition, and the only thing any religion is based on is hearsay.
When any person is thankful for their human condition that is when the Divine condition shows up. . Nothing else, NOTHING less, and certainly no amount of Gods, nor any amount of religions, particles, or any of the arts and sciences will unlock the truth of the divine condition. Nothing more than YOUR own appropriate feeling for your own human condition, will unlock THE true condition of the Divine. No one else can do that for your human condition, and the only thing any religion is based on is hearsay. Ken Shuffles

11:20am Tue 20 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

The only purpose of the human condition is to soak up an ocean of gratitude. To be thankful. Just to be thankful........


Divinity isn't complicated. I don't think being thankful for your humanity, your heart, your human condition, is too much to ask.
The only purpose of the human condition is to soak up an ocean of gratitude. To be thankful. Just to be thankful........ Divinity isn't complicated. I don't think being thankful for your humanity, your heart, your human condition, is too much to ask. Ken Shuffles

11:23am Tue 20 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

Love that is pure comes flooding at any moment we add some simplicity to it.
Love that is pure comes flooding at any moment we add some simplicity to it. Ken Shuffles

12:11pm Tue 20 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

The purpose of being alive is to enjoy each and every moment of life, of being alive, of being a human, and to feel that feeling of gratitude.
The purpose of being alive is to enjoy each and every moment of life, of being alive, of being a human, and to feel that feeling of gratitude. Ken Shuffles

12:14pm Tue 20 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

I am lost, when I drift away from that simple feeling.
I am lost, when I drift away from that simple feeling. Ken Shuffles

2:11pm Tue 20 Dec 11

DJ_Jaybee says...

Brok -

If by paganism you mean anything intelligent that was known before the church decreed what was allowed to be taught... and by lack of evidence, you mean that you haven't decided to research any part of it that has survived the deliberate attempts by the church to erase - anything not considered 'acceptable' science - and that conflicted with the papal view - then fair enough.

The church knows and anyone that can be bothered to look can see the mathematics they knew was highly advanced. Most sciences were at the level and in many cases more advanced than what they teach today in universities.

Gotta love the Church that has coveted such a treasure trove of ancient knowledge and whilst also chosing to destroy and burn as much public evidence as they could and even persecute their most learned scholars and advisors like Giornado Bruno as heretics. ROFL.

The important question is then - not IF they were more advanced, as anyone can confirm they were, as a wealth of information survived - but what DID they know that we have yet to 'discover'? Luckily for us they left the answers everywhere.

Now at least anyone can research this information without the church burning us - even if the energy companies don't want the universities teaching about it.
Brok - If by paganism you mean anything intelligent that was known before the church decreed what was allowed to be taught... and by lack of evidence, you mean that you haven't decided to research any part of it that has survived the deliberate attempts by the church to erase - anything not considered 'acceptable' science - and that conflicted with the papal view - then fair enough. The church knows and anyone that can be bothered to look can see the mathematics they knew was highly advanced. Most sciences were at the level and in many cases more advanced than what they teach today in universities. Gotta love the Church that has coveted such a treasure trove of ancient knowledge and whilst also chosing to destroy and burn as much public evidence as they could and even persecute their most learned scholars and advisors like Giornado Bruno as heretics. ROFL. The important question is then - not IF they were more advanced, as anyone can confirm they were, as a wealth of information survived - but what DID they know that we have yet to 'discover'? Luckily for us they left the answers everywhere. Now at least anyone can research this information without the church burning us - even if the energy companies don't want the universities teaching about it. DJ_Jaybee

4:23pm Tue 20 Dec 11

jack daniels says...

through the Book of His Word 'the Bible

Not King James words then??
through the Book of His Word 'the Bible Not King James words then?? jack daniels

5:32pm Tue 20 Dec 11

brok says...

DJ said:The important question is then - not IF they were more advanced, as anyone can confirm they were, as a wealth of information survived - but what DID they know that we have yet to 'discover'? Luckily for us they left the answers everywhere..."
You make some fair points. Theoretically, I would suppose that mathematics grew quickly because of its immutability, not so flexible as the written word or language.
However, I would like to be pointed towards some of these "answers" that are "everywhere" perhaps you could give us a few examples.
DJ said:The important question is then - not IF they were more advanced, as anyone can confirm they were, as a wealth of information survived - but what DID they know that we have yet to 'discover'? Luckily for us they left the answers everywhere..." You make some fair points. Theoretically, I would suppose that mathematics grew quickly because of its immutability, not so flexible as the written word or language. However, I would like to be pointed towards some of these "answers" that are "everywhere" perhaps you could give us a few examples. brok

6:18pm Tue 20 Dec 11

Revkev says...

Carlost wrote:
Hi Revkev

I know you are exited that scientists are looking for the "God Particle" but! they could just as well have called it the Dog particle, Cat particle or even the "Higgs Boson" ( after a Scotsman I do believe ). The effect they are trying to observe has nothing to do with your or anyone elses god and certainly has no relevance to the Bible or any other book of invented stories ( other than to expalin the matter they comprise of). I know people like you try to make these ridiculous links to proper scientific understanding of the world but you are just fooling yourselves and being dishonest with others. Just enjoy the wonder of the Scientific Method for what it is, and rejoice at the Intellect of the Human species, amen.
Hi Carlost,
I didn't make the link between the Higgs boson and the God Particle. You give me too much credit.
.
Physicist Leon Lederman did it in a book sometime on the thirties, I think. He said he gave the Higgs boson the nickname "The God Particle" because the particle is "so central to the state of physics today, so crucial to our understanding of the structure of matter, yet so elusive.
.
No doubt, being an honest man you'll be reaching for your laptop right now to dash off an apology.
[quote][p][bold]Carlost[/bold] wrote: Hi Revkev I know you are exited that scientists are looking for the "God Particle" but! they could just as well have called it the Dog particle, Cat particle or even the "Higgs Boson" ( after a Scotsman I do believe ). The effect they are trying to observe has nothing to do with your or anyone elses god and certainly has no relevance to the Bible or any other book of invented stories ( other than to expalin the matter they comprise of). I know people like you try to make these ridiculous links to proper scientific understanding of the world but you are just fooling yourselves and being dishonest with others. Just enjoy the wonder of the Scientific Method for what it is, and rejoice at the Intellect of the Human species, amen.[/p][/quote]Hi Carlost, I didn't make the link between the Higgs boson and the God Particle. You give me too much credit. . Physicist Leon Lederman did it in a book sometime on the thirties, I think. He said he gave the Higgs boson the nickname "The God Particle" because the particle is "so central to the state of physics today, so crucial to our understanding of the structure of matter, yet so elusive. . No doubt, being an honest man you'll be reaching for your laptop right now to dash off an apology. Revkev

7:07pm Tue 20 Dec 11

jogalot says...

Ken Shuffles wrote:
I am lost, when I drift away from that simple feeling.
Ken, I like your posts. Is this your website?
http://breathofhappi
ness.com/
[quote][p][bold]Ken Shuffles[/bold] wrote: I am lost, when I drift away from that simple feeling.[/p][/quote]Ken, I like your posts. Is this your website? http://breathofhappi ness.com/ jogalot

7:42pm Tue 20 Dec 11

DJ_Jaybee says...

Most important ancient sites are accurately situated in alignment with the earth grid and demonstrates that the builders were acutely aware of the numbers and sacred geometry of nature / the earth, and the relevant electromagnetic significance at these sites.

The greeks and egyptians used this mathematical knowledge for amplifying sound / harmonic resonance and the same principles can be found being used in most churches.

Many either in construction, decoration or both, encode important mathematical, geometric, astronomical and calendar knowledge showing they have a keen grasp of the mechanics of the universe and were using it (eg 51.83, 19.47 degrees, Phi, Golden Ratio (Divine Proportions 1.618, Fibonacci series solfeggio scales etc).

Examples being pretty much any of the main pyramids and temples, monuments around the world, Giza, Pyramid of Kukulkan at Chichén Itzá, Tiahuanaco, etc Yonaguni, Angkor wat, excavations at Harappa, Mohenjo-daro and other sites of the Indus Valley Civilization, Colombia, Machu Piccu, Cholula, temple of Solomon, Stuppa of Borobudur, Brihadeeswarar Temple, etc

Also many wisdom teaching documents and artefacts that survived from the west + the east, sumeria, china, japan, india, eg the Vedic Period provides evidence for the use of extremely large numbers. The Mayan & Aztec extremely accurate astronomical calendars.

More modern examples being Cathedral of Chartres, Notre-Dame of Laon, Notre Dame de Paris, pretty much any church built before 1500AD and even some after still demonstrate the architect's still retained the secret knowledge.

The Bahá'í knowledge teachings, any architecture based on kabbalistic principles and symbology, Rosslyn Chapel etc.

If anyone is in any doubt as to the intelligence of the ancient world they only need to contemplate what is being encoded with the combination of the Yin/Yang symbol and iChing 64 hexagram system to realise they were using a numeric system way ahead of the game and St John's biblical reference to man being a carbon based life form made of Carbon = 6 electrons 6 protons 6 neutrons - which is also the number of beast oil / coal earth threatening energy problem was a great more modern number reference.

At least physicists are gradually admitting a torus or (the more daring ones) a double torus shape for the shape of the universe so at least we are getting somewhere based on the geometry and number system pointed out by those early mathematicians who actually observed nature.

Sir Isaac Newton wrote more about Kabbalah than physics and although he was a Christian wrote over 80 books on Kabbalah. Either he didn't understand Kabbalah fully or was deliberately hiding parts from his students - as the Newtonian physics model we use today is incomplete and so requires a totally separate kind of physics (Quantum) physics to try and explain the missing bits...

That sneaky Mr Newton. Anyone Physicists wanting to know more about what the ancients knew should probably research why they considered the number 9 sacred.
Most important ancient sites are accurately situated in alignment with the earth grid and demonstrates that the builders were acutely aware of the numbers and sacred geometry of nature / the earth, and the relevant electromagnetic significance at these sites. The greeks and egyptians used this mathematical knowledge for amplifying sound / harmonic resonance and the same principles can be found being used in most churches. Many either in construction, decoration or both, encode important mathematical, geometric, astronomical and calendar knowledge showing they have a keen grasp of the mechanics of the universe and were using it (eg 51.83, 19.47 degrees, Phi, Golden Ratio (Divine Proportions 1.618, Fibonacci series solfeggio scales etc). Examples being pretty much any of the main pyramids and temples, monuments around the world, Giza, Pyramid of Kukulkan at Chichén Itzá, Tiahuanaco, etc Yonaguni, Angkor wat, excavations at Harappa, Mohenjo-daro and other sites of the Indus Valley Civilization, Colombia, Machu Piccu, Cholula, temple of Solomon, Stuppa of Borobudur, Brihadeeswarar Temple, etc Also many wisdom teaching documents and artefacts that survived from the west + the east, sumeria, china, japan, india, eg the Vedic Period provides evidence for the use of extremely large numbers. The Mayan & Aztec extremely accurate astronomical calendars. More modern examples being Cathedral of Chartres, Notre-Dame of Laon, Notre Dame de Paris, pretty much any church built before 1500AD and even some after still demonstrate the architect's still retained the secret knowledge. The Bahá'í knowledge teachings, any architecture based on kabbalistic principles and symbology, Rosslyn Chapel etc. If anyone is in any doubt as to the intelligence of the ancient world they only need to contemplate what is being encoded with the combination of the Yin/Yang symbol and iChing 64 hexagram system to realise they were using a numeric system way ahead of the game and St John's biblical reference to man being a carbon based life form made of Carbon = 6 electrons 6 protons 6 neutrons - which is also the number of beast oil / coal earth threatening energy problem was a great more modern number reference. At least physicists are gradually admitting a torus or (the more daring ones) a double torus shape for the shape of the universe so at least we are getting somewhere based on the geometry and number system pointed out by those early mathematicians who actually observed nature. Sir Isaac Newton wrote more about Kabbalah than physics and although he was a Christian wrote over 80 books on Kabbalah. Either he didn't understand Kabbalah fully or was deliberately hiding parts from his students - as the Newtonian physics model we use today is incomplete and so requires a totally separate kind of physics (Quantum) physics to try and explain the missing bits... That sneaky Mr Newton. Anyone Physicists wanting to know more about what the ancients knew should probably research why they considered the number 9 sacred. DJ_Jaybee

12:07am Wed 21 Dec 11

brok says...

Hi DJ.

Yes, yes, yes I can read all that on such websites as Foundation for Science and spirituality, DJ. But is it empirical evidence? Or is it just 'those errors handed down by metaphysical ages and men, which blind us and make us happy.' (to re-quote Nietzsche?) Even Denis Wheatley and Alistaire Crowley trotted out the same old guff under one disguise or another.
You may speak of grid lines and correlations you can list the same old same old from a dozen websites but it is NOT evidence. In fact, rather than answering, it creates conundrums. For example, what percentage of the buildings of their ilk comply with this lining up theory is that percentage significant enough to discount building constructed in such a way because of the influence of the rising and setting of the sun? Is there a more mundane explanation? Also see the note on Babylonian maths below.
Of course, Babylonian maths looks strange to us based as it is on only two symbols and the single strokes of many other cultures which gave rise to Roman numerals can excite in us theories about things that do not exist.
René Descartes of ‘Cogito ergo sum’ fame and of Cartesian mathematics certainly, in 1637, introduced the use of coordinates for describing plane curves but made no mention of any form of mysticism or ‘power’ attached to lined up pyramids temples or pre-15th cen churches.
The early Babylonians drew isosceles triangles on wet clay plates with needles. They baked the plates to keep them for a long time.
These plates were excavated at the Dynasty of King Hammurabi's era, about 1600 B.C. After deciphering the wedge-shaped letters, we can know that the Babylonians used very high system of calculation in commerce and agriculture with the sexagesimal (60based) positional system.
Babylonian geometry is intimately related to practical land measurement primarily because they were an agrarian culture. The chief feature of Babylonian geometry is algebraic character. (paraphrased from: http://library.think
quest.org/22584/). Any academic site dealing with the history of maths will tell you the same, without wrapping it up in gobbledegook.
Hi DJ. Yes, yes, yes I can read all that on such websites as Foundation for Science and spirituality, DJ. But is it empirical evidence? Or is it just 'those errors handed down by metaphysical ages and men, which blind us and make us happy.' (to re-quote Nietzsche?) Even Denis Wheatley and Alistaire Crowley trotted out the same old guff under one disguise or another. You may speak of grid lines and correlations you can list the same old same old from a dozen websites but it is NOT evidence. In fact, rather than answering, it creates conundrums. For example, what percentage of the buildings of their ilk comply with this lining up theory is that percentage significant enough to discount building constructed in such a way because of the influence of the rising and setting of the sun? Is there a more mundane explanation? Also see the note on Babylonian maths below. Of course, Babylonian maths looks strange to us based as it is on only two symbols and the single strokes of many other cultures which gave rise to Roman numerals can excite in us theories about things that do not exist. René Descartes of ‘Cogito ergo sum’ fame and of Cartesian mathematics certainly, in 1637, introduced the use of coordinates for describing plane curves but made no mention of any form of mysticism or ‘power’ attached to lined up pyramids temples or pre-15th cen churches. The early Babylonians drew isosceles triangles on wet clay plates with needles. They baked the plates to keep them for a long time. These plates were excavated at the Dynasty of King Hammurabi's era, about 1600 B.C. After deciphering the wedge-shaped letters, we can know that the Babylonians used very high system of calculation in commerce and agriculture with the sexagesimal (60based) positional system. Babylonian geometry is intimately related to practical land measurement primarily because they were an agrarian culture. The chief feature of Babylonian geometry is algebraic character. (paraphrased from: http://library.think quest.org/22584/). Any academic site dealing with the history of maths will tell you the same, without wrapping it up in gobbledegook. brok

2:18am Wed 21 Dec 11

DJ_Jaybee says...

Ok Brok,

Thanks for the response...

Rather than the gobbledegook then, trying to confirm any nonsense about ancient site locations, buildings being lined up to any earthly geometry, ancient astronomical knowledge or any deep mathematical understanding by anyone in the past - how about a more practical approach you can use to see nature a bit more like they were able to yourself?

The thing is, I think the main problem is that our modern day physicists are looking at things too closely and missing the messages that were already there at a basic level and making it more difficult than it needs to be... regardless of whether any great civilisation has papped on about it previously. It's like using they now insist on always using a microscope to try to read a newspaper headline.

The ancients may have used markers e.g.: the use of various god or angelic names to highlight that a symbol / number was meant to be noticed by the reader as important, but lets forget about all that mumbo-jumbo then for the moment.

If you are familiar with Cymatics - this is something you can actually perform yourself to experiment and view the effects of number and frequency visually in order to demonstrate to yourself the effects of how number/ frequency forms geometric shapes.

Without needing to travel to any ancient sites with measuring equipment and a compass. :)

Cymatics (from Greek: κῦμα "wave") is the study of visible sound and vibration. Different patterns emerge in the medium according to frequency.

We know from carvings in ceremonial chambers that the ancient priests and shamans observed the sound waves most likely created by observing the effects of their drums and instruments in smoke - allowing them to view the actual geometric patterns that sound/number created.

We also know that many ancient cultures used instruments, singing bowls, bells, peruvian whistling vessels etc that were tuned to have specific qualities, and have the ability to create these patterns that they could correlate to belong to a particular frequency, note or number.

Coupled with the fact that they constructed their buildings to amplify these effects, regardless of whether they were built in special locations - pretty much all the ancient civilisation were aware of the effects of these sounds on physical matter and how number and geometry were interconnected.

What has any of this got to do with the Higgs Boson?

Well because in the rush to find this predicted elementary particle - which they hope will answer the problems with the Standard Physics Model they seem to have totally avoided the elementary maths and geometry part.

They would rather concentrate on a fancy equation that is mainly there to cover up all the recurring numbers and bits you aren't supposed to notice that need sweeping under the carpet (renormalisation).

If they can't explain how a 0 actually manifests into a 1, or how the 1-8 2-7 3-6 4-5 and 9 numbers are related + the specific qualities of each - and admit that the universal geometry is fractal, just as we can observe in nature - then they are never gonna find the answer they are looking for at CERN.

My other point being that the energy companies have a vested interest in them not finding a unified physics model... and like many researchers in different academic fields have found when approaching their superiors with a potential solution or alternative approach have been told they are there to simply 'research' what they've been told - not provide solutions.
Ok Brok, Thanks for the response... Rather than the gobbledegook then, trying to confirm any nonsense about ancient site locations, buildings being lined up to any earthly geometry, ancient astronomical knowledge or any deep mathematical understanding by anyone in the past - how about a more practical approach you can use to see nature a bit more like they were able to yourself? The thing is, I think the main problem is that our modern day physicists are looking at things too closely and missing the messages that were already there at a basic level and making it more difficult than it needs to be... regardless of whether any great civilisation has papped on about it previously. It's like using they now insist on always using a microscope to try to read a newspaper headline. The ancients may have used markers e.g.: the use of various god or angelic names to highlight that a symbol / number was meant to be noticed by the reader as important, but lets forget about all that mumbo-jumbo then for the moment. If you are familiar with Cymatics - this is something you can actually perform yourself to experiment and view the effects of number and frequency visually in order to demonstrate to yourself the effects of how number/ frequency forms geometric shapes. Without needing to travel to any ancient sites with measuring equipment and a compass. :) Cymatics (from Greek: κῦμα "wave") is the study of visible sound and vibration. Different patterns emerge in the medium according to frequency. We know from carvings in ceremonial chambers that the ancient priests and shamans observed the sound waves most likely created by observing the effects of their drums and instruments in smoke - allowing them to view the actual geometric patterns that sound/number created. We also know that many ancient cultures used instruments, singing bowls, bells, peruvian whistling vessels etc that were tuned to have specific qualities, and have the ability to create these patterns that they could correlate to belong to a particular frequency, note or number. Coupled with the fact that they constructed their buildings to amplify these effects, regardless of whether they were built in special locations - pretty much all the ancient civilisation were aware of the effects of these sounds on physical matter and how number and geometry were interconnected. What has any of this got to do with the Higgs Boson? Well because in the rush to find this predicted elementary particle - which they hope will answer the problems with the Standard Physics Model they seem to have totally avoided the elementary maths and geometry part. They would rather concentrate on a fancy equation that is mainly there to cover up all the recurring numbers and bits you aren't supposed to notice that need sweeping under the carpet (renormalisation). If they can't explain how a 0 actually manifests into a 1, or how the 1-8 2-7 3-6 4-5 and 9 numbers are related + the specific qualities of each - and admit that the universal geometry is fractal, just as we can observe in nature - then they are never gonna find the answer they are looking for at CERN. My other point being that the energy companies have a vested interest in them not finding a unified physics model... and like many researchers in different academic fields have found when approaching their superiors with a potential solution or alternative approach have been told they are there to simply 'research' what they've been told - not provide solutions. DJ_Jaybee

3:03am Wed 21 Dec 11

DJ_Jaybee says...

Any particles like salt / sand + water effects are good to use for observing effects of different sound frequencies and the related geometric patterns they create. A standard sine wave tone generator that has the ability to go up / down in hz with fine tune is best for stabilising the patterns at the correct pitch.
Any particles like salt / sand + water effects are good to use for observing effects of different sound frequencies and the related geometric patterns they create. A standard sine wave tone generator that has the ability to go up / down in hz with fine tune is best for stabilising the patterns at the correct pitch. DJ_Jaybee

8:27am Wed 21 Dec 11

Joseph Yossarian says...

Revkev wrote:
Carlost wrote: Hi Revkev I know you are exited that scientists are looking for the "God Particle" but! they could just as well have called it the Dog particle, Cat particle or even the "Higgs Boson" ( after a Scotsman I do believe ). The effect they are trying to observe has nothing to do with your or anyone elses god and certainly has no relevance to the Bible or any other book of invented stories ( other than to expalin the matter they comprise of). I know people like you try to make these ridiculous links to proper scientific understanding of the world but you are just fooling yourselves and being dishonest with others. Just enjoy the wonder of the Scientific Method for what it is, and rejoice at the Intellect of the Human species, amen.
Hi Carlost, I didn't make the link between the Higgs boson and the God Particle. You give me too much credit. . Physicist Leon Lederman did it in a book sometime on the thirties, I think. He said he gave the Higgs boson the nickname "The God Particle" because the particle is "so central to the state of physics today, so crucial to our understanding of the structure of matter, yet so elusive. . No doubt, being an honest man you'll be reaching for your laptop right now to dash off an apology.
90's, not 30's I think.
[quote][p][bold]Revkev[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Carlost[/bold] wrote: Hi Revkev I know you are exited that scientists are looking for the "God Particle" but! they could just as well have called it the Dog particle, Cat particle or even the "Higgs Boson" ( after a Scotsman I do believe ). The effect they are trying to observe has nothing to do with your or anyone elses god and certainly has no relevance to the Bible or any other book of invented stories ( other than to expalin the matter they comprise of). I know people like you try to make these ridiculous links to proper scientific understanding of the world but you are just fooling yourselves and being dishonest with others. Just enjoy the wonder of the Scientific Method for what it is, and rejoice at the Intellect of the Human species, amen.[/p][/quote]Hi Carlost, I didn't make the link between the Higgs boson and the God Particle. You give me too much credit. . Physicist Leon Lederman did it in a book sometime on the thirties, I think. He said he gave the Higgs boson the nickname "The God Particle" because the particle is "so central to the state of physics today, so crucial to our understanding of the structure of matter, yet so elusive. . No doubt, being an honest man you'll be reaching for your laptop right now to dash off an apology.[/p][/quote]90's, not 30's I think. Joseph Yossarian

9:32am Wed 21 Dec 11

Revkev says...

Hi Joe.
Thanks for the correction - 1993 apparently.
Hi Joe. Thanks for the correction - 1993 apparently. Revkev

10:31am Wed 21 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

ONE very simple feeling is THE answer to everything. The Truth is a feeling, and The Human condition is a feeling machine. I am no mathematcian but........
ONE very simple feeling is THE answer to everything. The Truth is a feeling, and The Human condition is a feeling machine. I am no mathematcian but........ Ken Shuffles

1:37pm Wed 21 Dec 11

brok says...

Thank you DJ, I found your answer fascinating and appreciate the time and effort in preparing it.It will take some time to digest.
I understand (mostly) the importance of resonances of sound waves and the pattern formation and your last post goes a long way to demystifying your former articles. I agree with your comment about the acoustic properties of buildings, probably the most striking example would be the whispering gallery of St Paul's cathedral and I am aware of the acoustic theories attached to Stonehenge.
Certainly, the big bang/ 'god particle' idea does not enjoy universal acceptance throughout the scientific community, the research of Paul Steinhardt and Neil Turok of Cambridge University for example which would point at a cyclical (rhythmic?) explanation over 'trillions' of years, which, if taken seriously would put the proverbial cat among the pigeons.
Physicists not seeing the wood for the trees is, I must admit, for a layman, a difficult concept - given the obligation to adhere to scientific criteria - replicability, provability, ethical constraints and so on. Having said that, mistakes are made and new discoveries often point out fallibility.
I think we are at a point of agreement about CERN in that if the HB could be isolated it would merely lead to them having to 'build an even larger CERN to try to find an even smaller particle to try and reveal the missing piece'.
I have many problems with the ' big bang that was not a bang' theory, for example the thought that space was 'created' in this event, begging the question 'what was there before 'space'? And many other questions concerning space and Newton's three laws. But, this will suffice for now. I am not one hundred percent in agreement, but I can see common ground!
I am reminded of a piece of doggerel verse (Verse and Worse, Faber abd Faber mid 1960's)
'Great big fleas had little fleas
Upon their backs to bite 'em,
The little fleas had smaller fleas
and so on ad infinitum'
'Fleas' scans much better than 'sub atomic particles'.
Thank you DJ, I found your answer fascinating and appreciate the time and effort in preparing it.It will take some time to digest. I understand (mostly) the importance of resonances of sound waves and the pattern formation and your last post goes a long way to demystifying your former articles. I agree with your comment about the acoustic properties of buildings, probably the most striking example would be the whispering gallery of St Paul's cathedral and I am aware of the acoustic theories attached to Stonehenge. Certainly, the big bang/ 'god particle' idea does not enjoy universal acceptance throughout the scientific community, the research of Paul Steinhardt and Neil Turok of Cambridge University for example which would point at a cyclical (rhythmic?) explanation over 'trillions' of years, which, if taken seriously would put the proverbial cat among the pigeons. Physicists not seeing the wood for the trees is, I must admit, for a layman, a difficult concept - given the obligation to adhere to scientific criteria - replicability, provability, ethical constraints and so on. Having said that, mistakes are made and new discoveries often point out fallibility. I think we are at a point of agreement about CERN in that if the HB could be isolated it would merely lead to them having to 'build an even larger CERN to try to find an even smaller particle to try and reveal the missing piece'. I have many problems with the ' big bang that was not a bang' theory, for example the thought that space was 'created' in this event, begging the question 'what was there before 'space'? And many other questions concerning space and Newton's three laws. But, this will suffice for now. I am not one hundred percent in agreement, but I can see common ground! I am reminded of a piece of doggerel verse (Verse and Worse, Faber abd Faber mid 1960's) 'Great big fleas had little fleas Upon their backs to bite 'em, The little fleas had smaller fleas and so on ad infinitum' 'Fleas' scans much better than 'sub atomic particles'. brok

5:04pm Wed 21 Dec 11

Carlost says...

Hi Revkev

The point I was making was that when most scientists use the term " God particle" it is just a label. Not to be confused with the theological context in which people like yourself use and would like to infer on it. I apologise if I gave the impression that you had invented the phrase, I know you wouldn't be so mischeivious as to do such a thing.
Hi Revkev The point I was making was that when most scientists use the term " God particle" it is just a label. Not to be confused with the theological context in which people like yourself use and would like to infer on it. I apologise if I gave the impression that you had invented the phrase, I know you wouldn't be so mischeivious as to do such a thing. Carlost

7:21pm Wed 21 Dec 11

Revkev says...

Carlost wrote:
Hi Revkev

The point I was making was that when most scientists use the term " God particle" it is just a label. Not to be confused with the theological context in which people like yourself use and would like to infer on it. I apologise if I gave the impression that you had invented the phrase, I know you wouldn't be so mischeivious as to do such a thing.
Thanks, Carlost, for your kind comeback, which I understand and appreciate.
However, as to the "inferring" bit, I have to confess that I live and think in a theological context, and am more than happy when scientists start labelling things in these terms.
I do know they use the term rather poetically or figuratively, but I can't help patting them on the back for hitting the right target without knowing.
.
Actually, I do think that quite a few of scientists plumb the depth of their own disciplines only to find even deeper conundrums.
When they run out of physical explanations, many are left to ponder the metaphysical.
[quote][p][bold]Carlost[/bold] wrote: Hi Revkev The point I was making was that when most scientists use the term " God particle" it is just a label. Not to be confused with the theological context in which people like yourself use and would like to infer on it. I apologise if I gave the impression that you had invented the phrase, I know you wouldn't be so mischeivious as to do such a thing.[/p][/quote]Thanks, Carlost, for your kind comeback, which I understand and appreciate. However, as to the "inferring" bit, I have to confess that I live and think in a theological context, and am more than happy when scientists start labelling things in these terms. I do know they use the term rather poetically or figuratively, but I can't help patting them on the back for hitting the right target without knowing. . Actually, I do think that quite a few of scientists plumb the depth of their own disciplines only to find even deeper conundrums. When they run out of physical explanations, many are left to ponder the metaphysical. Revkev

9:17am Thu 22 Dec 11

Carlost says...

Revkev wrote:
Carlost wrote:
Hi Revkev

The point I was making was that when most scientists use the term " God particle" it is just a label. Not to be confused with the theological context in which people like yourself use and would like to infer on it. I apologise if I gave the impression that you had invented the phrase, I know you wouldn't be so mischeivious as to do such a thing.
Thanks, Carlost, for your kind comeback, which I understand and appreciate.
However, as to the "inferring" bit, I have to confess that I live and think in a theological context, and am more than happy when scientists start labelling things in these terms.
I do know they use the term rather poetically or figuratively, but I can't help patting them on the back for hitting the right target without knowing.
.
Actually, I do think that quite a few of scientists plumb the depth of their own disciplines only to find even deeper conundrums.
When they run out of physical explanations, many are left to ponder the metaphysical.
Hi Revkev

Yes I do gree with your last comment that life is full of conumdrums, paradox and bafflement. Thats what makes the search for understanding so exiting and the world so wonderous. Have a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.
[quote][p][bold]Revkev[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Carlost[/bold] wrote: Hi Revkev The point I was making was that when most scientists use the term " God particle" it is just a label. Not to be confused with the theological context in which people like yourself use and would like to infer on it. I apologise if I gave the impression that you had invented the phrase, I know you wouldn't be so mischeivious as to do such a thing.[/p][/quote]Thanks, Carlost, for your kind comeback, which I understand and appreciate. However, as to the "inferring" bit, I have to confess that I live and think in a theological context, and am more than happy when scientists start labelling things in these terms. I do know they use the term rather poetically or figuratively, but I can't help patting them on the back for hitting the right target without knowing. . Actually, I do think that quite a few of scientists plumb the depth of their own disciplines only to find even deeper conundrums. When they run out of physical explanations, many are left to ponder the metaphysical.[/p][/quote]Hi Revkev Yes I do gree with your last comment that life is full of conumdrums, paradox and bafflement. Thats what makes the search for understanding so exiting and the world so wonderous. Have a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. Carlost

11:04am Thu 22 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

May all be well for you all and I agree,


.


In this dense jumble of vague phantoms and other conumdrums, paradox, and bafflements of every emotive, mental and physical kind, it is exiting to know that in this topsy-turvey world where we are tossed around by destiny, fate, hope, and some misplaced fear, it feels good to understand that there is an eternal, sweet and beautiful ocean of gratitude, a shimmering simplicity and the clarity of perfection as well.
May all be well for you all and I agree, . In this dense jumble of vague phantoms and other conumdrums, paradox, and bafflements of every emotive, mental and physical kind, it is exiting to know that in this topsy-turvey world where we are tossed around by destiny, fate, hope, and some misplaced fear, it feels good to understand that there is an eternal, sweet and beautiful ocean of gratitude, a shimmering simplicity and the clarity of perfection as well. Ken Shuffles

11:12am Thu 22 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

Human beings have a potential, you have a potential that is greater than gods potential.


There is one thing, one moment, one experience, that even god and the big bang could not create.


.


Being thankful is an art, and only the human condition, is capable of creating gratitude, out of simplicity, a moment, and a breeze.
Human beings have a potential, you have a potential that is greater than gods potential. There is one thing, one moment, one experience, that even god and the big bang could not create. . Being thankful is an art, and only the human condition, is capable of creating gratitude, out of simplicity, a moment, and a breeze. Ken Shuffles

11:36am Thu 22 Dec 11

Revkev says...

Ken Shuffles wrote:
Human beings have a potential, you have a potential that is greater than gods potential.


There is one thing, one moment, one experience, that even god and the big bang could not create.


.


Being thankful is an art, and only the human condition, is capable of creating gratitude, out of simplicity, a moment, and a breeze.
Hello Ken,
As you probably know, Christianity teaches that God created you and your ability to be grateful.
He also provided our famous breath to help us say thank you.
Of course we never do it perfectly; in fact none of us are capable of perfection - you and me included.
This is why he sent his Son at that first Christmas to save us from the consequences of our imperfections.
What a saviour!
Happy Christmas.
[quote][p][bold]Ken Shuffles[/bold] wrote: Human beings have a potential, you have a potential that is greater than gods potential. There is one thing, one moment, one experience, that even god and the big bang could not create. . Being thankful is an art, and only the human condition, is capable of creating gratitude, out of simplicity, a moment, and a breeze.[/p][/quote]Hello Ken, As you probably know, Christianity teaches that God created you and your ability to be grateful. He also provided our famous breath to help us say thank you. Of course we never do it perfectly; in fact none of us are capable of perfection - you and me included. This is why he sent his Son at that first Christmas to save us from the consequences of our imperfections. What a saviour! Happy Christmas. Revkev

11:05am Fri 23 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

Kev,

If God is responsible for making gratitude, then God has created nothing more than robots. Gratitude is only Gratitude when it is Free and for no reason.


.


You assume a lot kevin. Just because You are not enjoying perfection, does not mean every person on the planet isn't. Can you prove no one is perfect. ?


.


You assume too much as far as I am concerned, I do enjoy perfection, and therefore I am enjoying feeling and being perfect. In fact, I rarely settle for anything less than perfection Kevin.


.


I am certainly not living with the consequences of my imperfection although you may inevitably have to continue to be.
Kev, If God is responsible for making gratitude, then God has created nothing more than robots. Gratitude is only Gratitude when it is Free and for no reason. . You assume a lot kevin. Just because You are not enjoying perfection, does not mean every person on the planet isn't. Can you prove no one is perfect. ? . You assume too much as far as I am concerned, I do enjoy perfection, and therefore I am enjoying feeling and being perfect. In fact, I rarely settle for anything less than perfection Kevin. . I am certainly not living with the consequences of my imperfection although you may inevitably have to continue to be. Ken Shuffles

11:11am Fri 23 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

People who follow Christians, may have to live with the consequences of Christian imperfections.



.


.....What a convenient and futile saviour the christian saviour has become.......
People who follow Christians, may have to live with the consequences of Christian imperfections. . .....What a convenient and futile saviour the christian saviour has become....... Ken Shuffles

11:41am Fri 23 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

Each human condition is perfect, but thanks to religions, we have a hard job accepting that. They don't want us to accept that all is well and that we are fine.


.


Thanks to a lot of constant undermining of the human condition by priests and other wannabe christs most individuals have been brainwashed to accept and to believe their own human condition is not perfect for them, and that just by following some strange handed down set of biblical notions that Jesus was never consulted about, when they're all dead and after they are all dead, the human condition they have today will be somehow all made sparkly and perfect for them in some new after death tomorrow.


.


Have you any evidence, that your Human Condition is not PERFECT for you right now ?
Each human condition is perfect, but thanks to religions, we have a hard job accepting that. They don't want us to accept that all is well and that we are fine. . Thanks to a lot of constant undermining of the human condition by priests and other wannabe christs most individuals have been brainwashed to accept and to believe their own human condition is not perfect for them, and that just by following some strange handed down set of biblical notions that Jesus was never consulted about, when they're all dead and after they are all dead, the human condition they have today will be somehow all made sparkly and perfect for them in some new after death tomorrow. . Have you any evidence, that your Human Condition is not PERFECT for you right now ? Ken Shuffles

11:54am Fri 23 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

The Human Condition, is more beautiful than a thousand temples and chapels.
The Human Condition, is more beautiful than a thousand temples and chapels. Ken Shuffles

4:36pm Fri 23 Dec 11

Revkev says...

Hi Ken,
I am a sinner.
I am not perfect, and am very grateful to my saviour that he saw it and died to pay the penalty of my sin.
Millions of others are likewise grateful.
.
I say God created gratitude because he created everything.
It is not a case of being a robot.
You for instance are able to take a completely different path with a set of beliefs that you are happy with.
Free will is preserved.
You have chosen to reach your own conclusions about what this life is and what it is not.
I believe the Bible says you are wrong.
You think you are right.
Hi Ken, I am a sinner. I am not perfect, and am very grateful to my saviour that he saw it and died to pay the penalty of my sin. Millions of others are likewise grateful. . I say God created gratitude because he created everything. It is not a case of being a robot. You for instance are able to take a completely different path with a set of beliefs that you are happy with. Free will is preserved. You have chosen to reach your own conclusions about what this life is and what it is not. I believe the Bible says you are wrong. You think you are right. Revkev

11:25am Sat 24 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

Try looking at your worth through the eyes of Jesus, or through the eyes of God. You must be quite special if the Son of God went to all that trouble and bother. Maybe, they looked on you as an innocent human being with the potential to feel the divine condition and be perfect. Maybe, they thought the human condition given to you was perfect enough to be touched by the divine condition.


.


Is there something imperfect about the mineral comndition ? the vegetable condition, the animal condition, or do you think it is just the human condition that is not perfect, or even worse, the divine condition that is not perfect enough for the human condition ??
Try looking at your worth through the eyes of Jesus, or through the eyes of God. You must be quite special if the Son of God went to all that trouble and bother. Maybe, they looked on you as an innocent human being with the potential to feel the divine condition and be perfect. Maybe, they thought the human condition given to you was perfect enough to be touched by the divine condition. . Is there something imperfect about the mineral comndition ? the vegetable condition, the animal condition, or do you think it is just the human condition that is not perfect, or even worse, the divine condition that is not perfect enough for the human condition ?? Ken Shuffles

11:27am Sat 24 Dec 11

Ken Shuffles says...

The Bible doesn't say I am wrong Kevin.
The Bible doesn't say I am wrong Kevin. Ken Shuffles

9:36pm Sat 24 Dec 11

enki jr says...

"brok says...
9:51am Tue 20 Dec 11

Irony, enki jr."

oh i see....


talking of irony, a local artist who goes by the name
of ACCRINGTONS PAL has released for a short period a yuletide "bootleg" of politically incorrect tunes called
"eat **** and eye" ... inc is the tune called "life is good" which was banned at short notice from the bbc programming at the request/complaints of some lesser mentally endowed pondslime at the H.A.R. in hyndburn ...
following the accusations that "THE UNSIGNED" were a racist band, the beeb removed the life is good track from the playlist,they didnt even inform the band or
contact thier agents to ask whether the accusations were true or not, they were hung,drawn and quartered without a trail so to speak ......so out of the death of the unsigned (the h.a.r. ruined the careers of some real talent) accringtons pal was born. some will find this album offensive, even though the 2nd album "the harlequins of hyndburn" is the pinnacle of offense yet to be released! im sure rev kev will like the first one,with it being about the annointed yids dad n all... anyhow if you find any of it funny then tell as many people to listen while its still on the web, and if you find it offensive then tell as many people to listen,HAVE A GOOD YULETIDE PEOPLE!

the album can be heard at ...

http://soundcloud.co
m/accringtons-pal/se
ts
"brok says... 9:51am Tue 20 Dec 11 Irony, enki jr." oh i see.... talking of irony, a local artist who goes by the name of ACCRINGTONS PAL has released for a short period a yuletide "bootleg" of politically incorrect tunes called "eat **** and eye" ... inc is the tune called "life is good" which was banned at short notice from the bbc programming at the request/complaints of some lesser mentally endowed pondslime at the H.A.R. in hyndburn ... following the accusations that "THE UNSIGNED" were a racist band, the beeb removed the life is good track from the playlist,they didnt even inform the band or contact thier agents to ask whether the accusations were true or not, they were hung,drawn and quartered without a trail so to speak ......so out of the death of the unsigned (the h.a.r. ruined the careers of some real talent) accringtons pal was born. some will find this album offensive, even though the 2nd album "the harlequins of hyndburn" is the pinnacle of offense yet to be released! im sure rev kev will like the first one,with it being about the annointed yids dad n all... anyhow if you find any of it funny then tell as many people to listen while its still on the web, and if you find it offensive then tell as many people to listen,HAVE A GOOD YULETIDE PEOPLE! the album can be heard at ... http://soundcloud.co m/accringtons-pal/se ts enki jr

Comments are closed on this article.

click2find

About cookies

We want you to enjoy your visit to our website. That's why we use cookies to enhance your experience. By staying on our website you agree to our use of cookies. Find out more about the cookies we use.

I agree