Hobbies and pastimes alone aren't enough to give life meaning (From Lancashire Telegraph)

""boring purposelessness of life""

Well, really......

I'm one of countless who do not believe in talking snakes, virgin births, living for over 900 years (etc....) and yet I find that my life is not boring and is full of purpose.

This an opinion column, so if the revvin Kevin wants to hold a view that we can't cope without God's help and also that we're designed to have an intimate personal relationship with God... well, leave him to that view. Both ideas are quite new to me. I've met several like the rev and none of them can be persuaded to give it up, so I'm not going to try too hard. Mystery of God's purpose and all that. Makes no sense to me. If I was a psychologist I might try to account for it as a brain anomaly, but I'm not so I'm wondering why I said that. I've read about that sort of explanation somewhere.

I am constantly astonished at how patronisingly judgemental you are about other people and what you suppose their lives are about.
I'm pretty sure that there is a little something written somewhere about 'judge not lest ye be judged'
Accordinging to your own beliefs there is a higher power that does the judginging....so perhaps you could keep keep your own judgements about folk to yourself.

""Life’s a can, and it implodes when what’s inside is not able to cope with the often-enormous pressures outside""

In which case, seeking help from a mental health professional would be an advisable course of action.

Indeed, one survey showed an increase in happiness amongst religious people compared to others - but only in societies lacking in food, jobs and healthcare. In richer countries, the religious are shown in the survey to be LESS happy.
(Gallup World Poll)

There are a variety of studies with mildly differing results on the correlation between happiness and religion. Cynically I would suggest (and I wish I had the time to verify) that those which are paid for by religions would show a positive link.

Psycologically and scientifically, singing and hanging around with like minded people in a church should decrease sadness; but then again the same could me said for a karaoke night with friends.

In any case, a correlation and causation are different things.

Ultimately, adhering to a religion is just another hobby to fill up part of your weekend.

We are designed to have an intimate personal relationship with our Self not God. Don't get me wrong, God is ok, I've nothing against an unknown higher power, but just like other flavours of emotional support and comfort blankets are removed on the last day, we will inevitably lose the comfort blanket of our religious entertainments.


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Only your Self will last forever, and you should use the time you have to get to know your Self and her beautiful nature, her beautiful peace, and her beautiful abundance of joy and understanding while there is still time. This is what the time is for, to get to know not God, but the nature of your own Self without which there would not be any God.

If it was not for your Self, not even one molecule, let alone the universe would have been required. ALL is for the sake of thine own Self and to that Self you should be True.

Peace comes not from God, it comes from your own Self.

All the answers, all that which really counts, will come pouring from your own Self. The rest doesn't matter that much.

Joseph Yossarian wrote:
""boring purposelessness of life""

Well, really......

I'm one of countless who do not believe in talking snakes, virgin births, living for over 900 years (etc....) and yet I find that my life is not boring and is full of purpose.

True, Joseph.
One of the things that keeps you going is commenting on what others do or say. Being a critic of life and how its lived contributes, no doubt among many other things, to your purpose in life.
.
I'm simply saying that without these you'd be bored. Then I'm adding the thought that we were designed to be filled with that which is higher and better.

Toti Dogsto wrote:
This an opinion column, so if the revvin Kevin wants to hold a view that we can't cope without God's help and also that we're designed to have an intimate personal relationship with God... well, leave him to that view. Both ideas are quite new to me. I've met several like the rev and none of them can be persuaded to give it up, so I'm not going to try too hard. Mystery of God's purpose and all that. Makes no sense to me. If I was a psychologist I might try to account for it as a brain anomaly, but I'm not so I'm wondering why I said that. I've read about that sort of explanation somewhere.

Hi Toti,
No doubt your exotic name has a logical explanation. I wouldn't for a moment think that you'd call yourself Toti Dogsto because you had a brain abnormality. I simply accept that you know something about your life and circumstances that I don't.
.
I read that the column's ideas about God are new to you. There are a whole host of sensible reasons for believing that God is best explanation for what we see and experience in our lives.
He';s well worth pursuing.
Your could start with the Bible, perhaps one of the four Gospels in the New Testament - or even all four!
What I found as I did this 40 years ago changed my life completely. Millions have the same testimony to offer.
Can't all be down to a brain abnormality, surely.

Heretical wrote:
I am constantly astonished at how patronisingly judgemental you are about other people and what you suppose their lives are about.
I'm pretty sure that there is a little something written somewhere about 'judge not lest ye be judged'
Accordinging to your own beliefs there is a higher power that does the judginging....so perhaps you could keep keep your own judgements about folk to yourself.

Hi Heretical,
Am I not stating the obvious when I write that life is boring without interesting things to do?
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To this I'm simply adding the Christian truth that we're designed by God to have a relationship with him. We're here to enjoy his company.
.
I'm then simply explaining that when we try to fill what is a God-shaped vacuum in our lives with other things, we feel less than satisfied.

Ken Shuffles wrote:
Peace comes not from God, it comes from your own Self.

Ken,
The self-satisfied life never quite worked for me.
I gave it a fair shot - godless for the first 28 years of life.
I have to confess that the more I relied on self, the less satisfied I was.
I had to come to unpalatable truth that I was a selfish, self-satisfied sinner and needed saving.
Thank God he loved me enough to come down in Jesus and do just that.
.
By the way, even now I'm not satisfied with self.
I still could do better.
.
However, what I now have is a peace that passes all human understanding; a peace that doesn't rely on me being in the centre of an often chaotic universe; a peace that comes from knowing that my Dad's in charge of the whole shooting match, and he loves me and looks after me and my loved ones.
.
That's what keeps me writing each week.
I'd love others to hit the jackpot as I have, by the grace of God.

Kevin,

We all feel as if we have hit the jackpot. We know that where there is boredom an interesting thing will come, and just when things get interesting and exciting boredom will creep in. Time has sunk it's claw into all things and though some things we believe in last a longer/shorter time than others it is incumbent upon us as human beings to understand the eternal. The being must be fully understood by the human.

Kindness is eternal. All Joy and happiness and peace and knowledge and understanding ascribed to the Self is eternal. It is the simple nature of these things to be eternal. They don't need a God to make them eternal. They have always been eternal for humans. Nothing will ever change that no matter how many churches and temples and mosques and monuments and chants and bells and whistles or rules and balls we break.

The only Science that is worthwhile is The Eternal Science. All other sciences are rubbish.

Something Eternal is Real.

Something not Eternal is NOT a Reality. There may be an appearance of something else, an illusion of something else that lasts, for a time but who is right about who owns all the molecules is NOT the main event.


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All we can say for sure, with any honesty, is that you and me are not the owners of these molecules.

We are the Audience and Perception.

Revkev wrote:

Joseph Yossarian wrote: ""boring purposelessness of life"" Well, really...... I'm one of countless who do not believe in talking snakes, virgin births, living for over 900 years (etc....) and yet I find that my life is not boring and is full of purpose.

True, Joseph. One of the things that keeps you going is commenting on what others do or say. Being a critic of life and how its lived contributes, no doubt among many other things, to your purpose in life. . I'm simply saying that without these you'd be bored. Then I'm adding the thought that we were designed to be filled with that which is higher and better.

One of the things which keeps me going is commenting on what others do or say?

Could you be more condescending or insulting if you possibly tried? On what basis could you possibly make such an assumption?

It is because as a "preacher" you feel it is your duty to try to tell others to think and you do and think that others who pass comment have the same drive?

If so, you are wide of the mark.

Or is it that you (as we have seen repeatedly) like to have a misinformed dig at your detractors to try to belittle those who quite rightly take umbridge at your (being kind now) somewhat dated approach to society.



The reality is that I find your weekly fundamentilst diabribe boring.

I hope you keep it up though. It shows your true colours; how you hide behind the mask of religious respectibility to propogate your own opinions.

"""Hi Heretical,
Am I not stating the obvious when I write that life is boring without interesting things to do?""

That is quite clearly not the theme of your column; once again you attempt to change your direction when you are put under scrutiny.

We can see the theme of your column (roughly) from the following quote:
""Now, don’t get me wrong: each of the above brightens humdrum lives but individually and even collectively they’re hopeless at stopping body and soul from imploding as problems press in from a hostile world. That, thousands of Lancastrians are reminded in Sunday's church bible readings, is God’s job ""


The theme of your column is in fact the opposite of your response to poster Heretical. The theme of your column is (roughly put) religion is the answer.

My life is brightened up more by taking the dog for a walk than it ever was by sitting through a sermon.

Joseph Yossarian wrote:
""boring purposelessness of life""

Well, really......

I'm one of countless who do not believe in talking snakes, virgin births, living for over 900 years (etc....) and yet I find that my life is not boring and is full of purpose.

Totally agree. -- Kevin might find his life boring and meaningless without his imaginary friend but I think it’s very presumptuous of him (as always) to confer his shortcomings onto the rest of us. I have my up and down days like everyone but on the whole I find the love, friendship and affection of my family and friends more than enough to fulfil my short time on this planet. Add to that the wonders of nature (ref. Brain Cox, Richard Dawkins, Richrd Attenborough) the human achievements in Art, Music, Medicine, Science, etc. etc. there are a million and one fantastic reasons to enjoy life and feel fulfilled. You be a dead old empty can if you want Revkev but please don’t assume the rest of us are.

Anyone who hasn't felt parched and bored or missing some sense of meaning and purpose in their life at some point hasn't ever really lived if you ask me and I think even christians like Kevin, if he is honest, can experience a sudden loss of meaning and purpose at times, depending I suppose how interesting the coffee is.


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Just be a human being, because a human being is all any human being can be.

Fulfilling a persons time, a person's religion, a person's God is not the same thing as fulfilling a person. Fulfilling a person is a different thing altogether than doing the right thing as agreed by your convenient like-minded peers.

Life can still be boring and meaningless at times even WITH an imaginary friend.

Godding and Dogging weekenders are not really that different and both can be useful Pets.

Fulfilling does not happen for any old nonsensical or vague reason. Fulfilling is practical, either you can feel your self fulfilling or you are not.

Revkev wrote:

Toti Dogsto wrote:
This an opinion column, so if the revvin Kevin wants to hold a view that we can't cope without God's help and also that we're designed to have an intimate personal relationship with God... well, leave him to that view. Both ideas are quite new to me. I've met several like the rev and none of them can be persuaded to give it up, so I'm not going to try too hard. Mystery of God's purpose and all that. Makes no sense to me. If I was a psychologist I might try to account for it as a brain anomaly, but I'm not so I'm wondering why I said that. I've read about that sort of explanation somewhere.

Hi Toti,
No doubt your exotic name has a logical explanation. I wouldn't for a moment think that you'd call yourself Toti Dogsto because you had a brain abnormality. I simply accept that you know something about your life and circumstances that I don't.
.
I read that the column's ideas about God are new to you. There are a whole host of sensible reasons for believing that God is best explanation for what we see and experience in our lives.
He';s well worth pursuing.
Your could start with the Bible, perhaps one of the four Gospels in the New Testament - or even all four!
What I found as I did this 40 years ago changed my life completely. Millions have the same testimony to offer.
Can't all be down to a brain abnormality, surely.

Boyer, Pascal Boyer - that's the fellow I've read about the psychology of religion.

Anomaly, not abnormality, Kevin.

I'm new to the business of corresponding this way, and decided not to use my real name. My reason is nothing to do with a feeling of being able to say what I like, even insulting things, without identifying myself. I enjoy making up silly words, that's all.

Kevin, you liken the behaviour of the can to our experience of life. Here's another exercise.

Think of a car with a busted reverse gear. The driver can go only forward or stop, no matter how risky those actions might be.

Some people are like that. Without a 'reverse gear' they can't try another avenue, or admit that they're wrong to go ahead.

The religious people I meet have no reverse gear. Most people I meet have a reverse gear, and some have two or three.

Joseph Yossarian wrote:
"""Hi Heretical,
Am I not stating the obvious when I write that life is boring without interesting things to do?""

That is quite clearly not the theme of your column; once again you attempt to change your direction when you are put under scrutiny.

We can see the theme of your column (roughly) from the following quote:
""Now, don’t get me wrong: each of the above brightens humdrum lives but individually and even collectively they’re hopeless at stopping body and soul from imploding as problems press in from a hostile world. That, thousands of Lancastrians are reminded in Sunday's church bible readings, is God’s job ""


The theme of your column is in fact the opposite of your response to poster Heretical. The theme of your column is (roughly put) religion is the answer.

My life is brightened up more by taking the dog for a walk than it ever was by sitting through a sermon.

Thank you, Joe, for your rough estimates.
.
Actually, I have to correct you on the last two sentences. The column was not about religion being the answer, but about God being the answer. There is a difference, a huge difference, as I've tried to indicate before.
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Religion is man's efforts to 'do' God, or reach him, and it's usually full of rituals, sermons, hymns and other imperfect things. Imperfect because it is in the hands of imperfect humans.
'
What I'm writing about week by week is an intimate relationship with God; knowing Jesus personally and walking through life in the power by God's Spirit.

Hi Joe,
You quoted part of my reply to you.,.."One of the things which keeps me going is commenting on what others do or say?"
And you replied, "Could you be more condescending or insulting if you possibly tried? On what basis could you possibly make such an assumption?"
.
I'm sorry you took it this way.
I really was just pointing out that as you take a lot of time and care over sending in your contributions and criticisms to this columnist and others, you obviously think it is an important part of your life.
.
It was no't meant in any way as an insult.

Toti Dogsto wrote:

Revkev wrote:

Toti Dogsto wrote:
This an opinion column, so if the revvin Kevin wants to hold a view that we can't cope without God's help and also that we're designed to have an intimate personal relationship with God... well, leave him to that view. Both ideas are quite new to me. I've met several like the rev and none of them can be persuaded to give it up, so I'm not going to try too hard. Mystery of God's purpose and all that. Makes no sense to me. If I was a psychologist I might try to account for it as a brain anomaly, but I'm not so I'm wondering why I said that. I've read about that sort of explanation somewhere.

Hi Toti,
No doubt your exotic name has a logical explanation. I wouldn't for a moment think that you'd call yourself Toti Dogsto because you had a brain abnormality. I simply accept that you know something about your life and circumstances that I don't.
.
I read that the column's ideas about God are new to you. There are a whole host of sensible reasons for believing that God is best explanation for what we see and experience in our lives.
He';s well worth pursuing.
Your could start with the Bible, perhaps one of the four Gospels in the New Testament - or even all four!
What I found as I did this 40 years ago changed my life completely. Millions have the same testimony to offer.
Can't all be down to a brain abnormality, surely.

Boyer, Pascal Boyer - that's the fellow I've read about the psychology of religion.

Anomaly, not abnormality, Kevin.

I'm new to the business of corresponding this way, and decided not to use my real name. My reason is nothing to do with a feeling of being able to say what I like, even insulting things, without identifying myself. I enjoy making up silly words, that's all.

Kevin, you liken the behaviour of the can to our experience of life. Here's another exercise.

Think of a car with a busted reverse gear. The driver can go only forward or stop, no matter how risky those actions might be.

Some people are like that. Without a 'reverse gear' they can't try another avenue, or admit that they're wrong to go ahead.

The religious people I meet have no reverse gear. Most people I meet have a reverse gear, and some have two or three.

Thanks Toti Dogsto for your interesting reply, and correcting me on 'anomaly'.
I like your analogy of reverse gear.
I've got one, as you see above. I do make mistakes and try to reverse to a more accurate position.
.
That said, In forty years, I've still meet meet anything or argument that would make me want to reverse away from my relationship with God.

Revkev wrote:

Toti Dogsto wrote:

Revkev wrote:

Toti Dogsto wrote:
This an opinion column, so if the revvin Kevin wants to hold a view that we can't cope without God's help and also that we're designed to have an intimate personal relationship with God... well, leave him to that view. Both ideas are quite new to me. I've met several like the rev and none of them can be persuaded to give it up, so I'm not going to try too hard. Mystery of God's purpose and all that. Makes no sense to me. If I was a psychologist I might try to account for it as a brain anomaly, but I'm not so I'm wondering why I said that. I've read about that sort of explanation somewhere.

Hi Toti,
No doubt your exotic name has a logical explanation. I wouldn't for a moment think that you'd call yourself Toti Dogsto because you had a brain abnormality. I simply accept that you know something about your life and circumstances that I don't.
.
I read that the column's ideas about God are new to you. There are a whole host of sensible reasons for believing that God is best explanation for what we see and experience in our lives.
He';s well worth pursuing.
Your could start with the Bible, perhaps one of the four Gospels in the New Testament - or even all four!
What I found as I did this 40 years ago changed my life completely. Millions have the same testimony to offer.
Can't all be down to a brain abnormality, surely.

Boyer, Pascal Boyer - that's the fellow I've read about the psychology of religion.

Anomaly, not abnormality, Kevin.

I'm new to the business of corresponding this way, and decided not to use my real name. My reason is nothing to do with a feeling of being able to say what I like, even insulting things, without identifying myself. I enjoy making up silly words, that's all.

Kevin, you liken the behaviour of the can to our experience of life. Here's another exercise.

Think of a car with a busted reverse gear. The driver can go only forward or stop, no matter how risky those actions might be.

Some people are like that. Without a 'reverse gear' they can't try another avenue, or admit that they're wrong to go ahead.

The religious people I meet have no reverse gear. Most people I meet have a reverse gear, and some have two or three.

Thanks Toti Dogsto for your interesting reply, and correcting me on 'anomaly'.
I like your analogy of reverse gear.
I've got one, as you see above. I do make mistakes and try to reverse to a more accurate position.
.
That said, In forty years, I've still meet meet anything or argument that would make me want to reverse away from my relationship with God.

See how easy it is to sneak out of an argument about an analogy? Fun to use, but no good when it matters.

Revkev wrote:
Hi Joe, You quoted part of my reply to you.,.."One of the things which keeps me going is commenting on what others do or say?" And you replied, "Could you be more condescending or insulting if you possibly tried? On what basis could you possibly make such an assumption?" . I'm sorry you took it this way. I really was just pointing out that as you take a lot of time and care over sending in your contributions and criticisms to this columnist and others, you obviously think it is an important part of your life. . It was no't meant in any way as an insult.

No, it is not an important part of my life at all so try to drop your presumptuousness.

It is a small diversion.

You claim to write about your intimate personal relationship with god; what you in fact do is use the religious documents of the testaments to justify your personal prejudices.

Revkev wrote:

Toti Dogsto wrote:

Revkev wrote:

Toti Dogsto wrote: This an opinion column, so if the revvin Kevin wants to hold a view that we can't cope without God's help and also that we're designed to have an intimate personal relationship with God... well, leave him to that view. Both ideas are quite new to me. I've met several like the rev and none of them can be persuaded to give it up, so I'm not going to try too hard. Mystery of God's purpose and all that. Makes no sense to me. If I was a psychologist I might try to account for it as a brain anomaly, but I'm not so I'm wondering why I said that. I've read about that sort of explanation somewhere.

Hi Toti, No doubt your exotic name has a logical explanation. I wouldn't for a moment think that you'd call yourself Toti Dogsto because you had a brain abnormality. I simply accept that you know something about your life and circumstances that I don't. . I read that the column's ideas about God are new to you. There are a whole host of sensible reasons for believing that God is best explanation for what we see and experience in our lives. He';s well worth pursuing. Your could start with the Bible, perhaps one of the four Gospels in the New Testament - or even all four! What I found as I did this 40 years ago changed my life completely. Millions have the same testimony to offer. Can't all be down to a brain abnormality, surely.

Boyer, Pascal Boyer - that's the fellow I've read about the psychology of religion. Anomaly, not abnormality, Kevin. I'm new to the business of corresponding this way, and decided not to use my real name. My reason is nothing to do with a feeling of being able to say what I like, even insulting things, without identifying myself. I enjoy making up silly words, that's all. Kevin, you liken the behaviour of the can to our experience of life. Here's another exercise. Think of a car with a busted reverse gear. The driver can go only forward or stop, no matter how risky those actions might be. Some people are like that. Without a 'reverse gear' they can't try another avenue, or admit that they're wrong to go ahead. The religious people I meet have no reverse gear. Most people I meet have a reverse gear, and some have two or three.

Thanks Toti Dogsto for your interesting reply, and correcting me on 'anomaly'. I like your analogy of reverse gear. I've got one, as you see above. I do make mistakes and try to reverse to a more accurate position. . That said, In forty years, I've still meet meet anything or argument that would make me want to reverse away from my relationship with God.

So are you advocating the merits of your religion every week, or writing about the personal relationship you have with God.? It sounds like you are sitting on the fence. Is it anything to do with God or just about your personal choice of reading matter.

God doesn't need the Bible, or any other prejudiced testimonials from anyone ancient or modern to back up his power and glory.

think i will stick to being a happy and very busy atheist thanks

There are two kinds of happiness in this world, one is a formula and the other is the feeling. It's the same with Peace, there is a formula, and there is the feeling.

Once, I asked a man why he was happy, he said because I have a beautiful wife and beautiful kids and beautiful friends and a beautiful house and a beautiful career and a beautiful car/pets etc. etc.


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Then I asked a monk what made him happy and he said, because I don't have a wife and I don't have a family and I don't have a mortgage, job, car, pets etc. etc.

Are you propagating a cult-activity formula Kev or the ultimate thing in feeling?

The experiment you describe wouldn't work too well if the can holds no liquid. It's better to have a little of the drink or water in the can. Heating the can and so heating its liquid contents fills the can with vapour, which condenses when cooled in the ice. The pressure inside the can reduces quickly, since it was provided largely by the vapour. The greater atmospheric pressure on the outer surface of the can then causes the can to collapse.

Incidentally, your mention of iced water can mislead, for ice is water. I remember being confused by my geography teacher, who spoke of ice 'turning back' into water.

Toti Aiyrk wrote:
The experiment you describe wouldn't work too well if the can holds no liquid. It's better to have a little of the drink or water in the can. Heating the can and so heating its liquid contents fills the can with vapour, which condenses when cooled in the ice. The pressure inside the can reduces quickly, since it was provided largely by the vapour. The greater atmospheric pressure on the outer surface of the can then causes the can to collapse.

Incidentally, your mention of iced water can mislead, for ice is water. I remember being confused by my geography teacher, who spoke of ice 'turning back' into water.

Hi Toti,
Ten out of ten for you.
Can't squeeze everything into 300 words.

Ice is water and space, water is just water without the space. Nothing has changed fundamentally, the water is the water and the space is the space and the fire is the same fire and the earth is the same earth and the wind is the same wind. There is the same atmosphere, pressure and air today as there was when the universe was created. Nothing has been turned into anything that didn't get changed back and no amount of anything has been lost or harmed in the process.


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Even the potential s the same potential and the fulfillment is the same fulfillment and the joy is the same joy and the love and the happiness that is felt and the turmoil is just the same if you are human. I'm not speaking for other creatures.

The Truth, is not a word, but it is still the same Truth as it has always been.

The Truth has been squeezed into your heart and fibre of your being. It couldn't be sqeezed into any amount of words.

The Truth can answer ALL questions, even the ones that you may not have even found the words to ask yet.