Public sector strikes: List of East Lancashire school closures (From Lancashire Telegraph)

Poor kids...

There is no support for these strikes... A bunch of pathetic public sector workers thinking they deserve more!

Try working in the private sector!!

The only redeeming feature is that only 25% of the public sector support these strikes...

The other 75% have got sense!!

As someonewho started off working in the public sector, was privatised by Harold Wison and lost my pension, then had it robbed again by Margaret Thatcher and then again by Gordon Brown, I for one have every sympathy for them. 22 millionaires in this Tory/Lib/Dem cabinet, most of them having never done a days work in their lives, robbing some of the hardest working and poorest in our society, they should hang their heads in shame and resign!

When a parent tries to take a child out of school for a personal reason they are told they they are interfering with the childs education which is paramount.
When teachers want to go on strike for even better pay, that's not a problem.

We know where thier priorities lie.

Oh well, the kids will enjoy a day off school. I hope it snows like mad. The kids will love that being off and the strikers will be freezing.

The lot of them are a waste of time and should be sacked they should try working in the private sector and then they would know what work is.
Most of them have not enough qualifications to teach a dog tricks.

@BuckoTheMoose
If people in the public sector can't strike, how can they vent their grievances and expect to be heard, rather than ignored?

At every school our children have attended we have been told that any time off for pupils during term time is not allowed.

Teachers go on strike and then it doesn't seem to matter about the children's education.

I recommend every parent to put in lots of requests for time off during term time, quoting the strike as justification.

How do these strikers think these children are going to be looked after on the strike day? Well we will need to take a day out of our holiday entitlement and the teachers still get their full holidays.

Teachers should set examples to our children. They clearly do not understand the basics.

Dave_P wrote:
@BuckoTheMoose
If people in the public sector can't strike, how can they vent their grievances and expect to be heard, rather than ignored?

By negotiation & discussion and if they are unhappy with the outcome and their benefits and they think people are doing better elsewhere, then hand in your notice as soon as you get a new, better job.

Pathetic!

What upsets me most is the number of church schools who are striking. What about suffer little children!

Viglen wrote:
As someonewho started off working in the public sector, was privatised by Harold Wison and lost my pension, then had it robbed again by Margaret Thatcher and then again by Gordon Brown, I for one have every sympathy for them. 22 millionaires in this Tory/Lib/Dem cabinet, most of them having never done a days work in their lives, robbing some of the hardest working and poorest in our society, they should hang their heads in shame and resign!

Yes very good, we all know politicians are crap. We are all let down by them the same.

This can't justify the completely selfish behaviour of those striking however. Those people are striking to make the vast majority of people, who are already skint themselves, pay their totally unfair and unsustainable pensions. Pretty much all of those paying can only dream of pensions so monumentally generous. Many of those people are the lowest paid in society with the most unenviable jobs, and have absolutely no pensions themselves, yet they are expected to pay someone else's bloated pension.

How disgustingly selfish.

There are more labour millionaire MPs than conservatives btw.

What I find annoying about these strikes is that many will not actually be on a pcket line but sat at home. I know from the last teachers strike that most of the teachers in the school I worked in didn't stand on a picket line but saw it as a day off, even if without pay. One actually complained she couldn't picket because she had to look after her kids as their school was shut due to the strike!

Everyone on here having a go at public sector workers,at least they stand up for themselves rather than you lot (the sheeple slagging the strikers off) who put up and comply with whatever the government does to you.How will a race to the bottom improve private sector pensions.

Good call wrote:
Everyone on here having a go at public sector workers,at least they stand up for themselves rather than you lot (the sheeple slagging the strikers off) who put up and comply with whatever the government does to you.How will a race to the bottom improve private sector pensions.

Totally agree Good Call, if workers don't make a stand we will all be living in poverty come retirement age. I for one will be striking & joining the pickets on Wednesday, this government has no mandate for these attacks on the lowest paid!

Everyone on here having a go at public sector workers,at least they stand up for themselves rather than you lot (the sheeple slagging the strikers off) who put up and comply with whatever the government does to you. a race to the bottom on public sector pensions won't improve private sector pensions.

these people are so selfish and probably cant see that they are being led by the union activists who have probably told them a pack of lies. I was in the civil service in the 70s and was encouraged to strike but we did not agree with what we were being told by the trade union official, which turned out to be misleading information as it happened, as in this case about the pensions changes. The folk at the top of the civil service and the unions are looking after number one as usual.

cat woman wrote:
What I find annoying about these strikes is that many will not actually be on a pcket line but sat at home. I know from the last teachers strike that most of the teachers in the school I worked in didn't stand on a picket line but saw it as a day off, even if without pay. One actually complained she couldn't picket because she had to look after her kids as their school was shut due to the strike!

There are laws against the number of people allowed on picket lines....
If you want to gauge the support, nip down blackburn on wednesday and gauge the support.

Good call wrote:
Everyone on here having a go at public sector workers,at least they stand up for themselves rather than you lot (the sheeple slagging the strikers off) who put up and comply with whatever the government does to you.How will a race to the bottom improve private sector pensions.

Yeah you are right, public sector workers do stand up for themselves.

At massive cost and detriment to everyone else.

The average joe on the street pays a fortune for other people's pension. A luxury they can't afford themselves but are forced to pay.

How supremely selfish of public sector workers.

Good call wrote:
Everyone on here having a go at public sector workers,at least they stand up for themselves rather than you lot (the sheeple slagging the strikers off) who put up and comply with whatever the government does to you.How will a race to the bottom improve private sector pensions.

Race to the bottom. What a fantastic point!

You can easily pick out the low brow, selfish individuals who don’t have an ounce of empathy for other people and still believe the capitalist drivel about council employees being highly paid. Not one of these people will actually list REAL jobs that need cutting.

Maybe I should start the ball rolling then?

Ok, lets sack all the housing officers at the Town Hall.

Who’s going to process all the housing benefit claims. Who’s going deal with the homeless. Come on Bucko, Pwitch, cat woman and the rest. Who sorts this out?

Will you?

Nah, you’ll just sit there with you head in the sand and watch children freeze to death.

What makes this really funny is that when council services for residential care or home help was privatised, the quality of care dropped too. There have been recent reports about this in the press and this is a fantastic example of the fact that you need to pay people a real wage to do the cr@p jobs.

That’s all the council staff are asking for. It’s your company managers in their BMW’s that are screwing you over, not the hard working council staff.

How can people in the private sector do anything about their pensions ? the answer - we cant because we live in the real world > when markets /investments go up then so do our pensions , and when they fall so do our pensions. We cant all have a public subsidised money pot waiting for us when we retire and certainly not in our fifties . and yes we pay into them as well - you dont know lucky you are !! You want to wake up and come into the real world ! you should be ashamed !!!

DougFlo wrote:

Dave_P wrote:
@BuckoTheMoose
If people in the public sector can't strike, how can they vent their grievances and expect to be heard, rather than ignored?

By negotiation & discussion and if they are unhappy with the outcome and their benefits and they think people are doing better elsewhere, then hand in your notice as soon as you get a new, better job.

Pathetic!

Thanks. Well said.

I cant go out on strike as i have been transfered out from the public sector to the private sector.

So I will be finding time during my day off to go on the demostration and support my colleagues in the public sector

How is standing up for yourself and taking the day off work (unpaid) a bad thing? Some people need to get a grip on here. The public sector workers are some of the hardest working and least appreciated in the country. They have put up with such whinging bastards on here day after day and then paid through the nose on a false promise of a decent pension only to get shafted good and proper to make up for the overspending government. You should be pointing the finger of blame elsewhere, not at those prepared to stand up for themselves for what will no doubt be a lost cause.

I work for the NHS, i am going to be on the march on Wednesday. This government wants me to work longer, pay more into my pension to receive less out. This is not a war between private and public sector this is ALL public sector workers (dinner ladies, nhs, etc not just teachers) trying to protect our pensions. So those of you who say your tax is paying for my pension then 1) what is my tax paying for? 2) why am i paying into the scheme? I cant see Mr Camoron working til he is 67 and doing the job i do. But it is ok for him to get tickets for the Olympics funded by US taxpayers. Whatever the government get away with now how far will it go and where will it filter through to? I do feel for the people who work in the private sector who have had their pensions robbed so because that happened to you does that make it ok for the government to do it to us? You should fight for your own rights. I will get about £100 per week when i retire after working all of my life. Hardly think thats luxury or a dream (to quote some of you!) I will be better off on benefits. Think i might resign now. We have had a pay freeze for the last 3 years too. We dont want more we just dont want less than £100 per week.

Well, all I have to say is that I support all the public sector workers, but also, it is Fact that the Pension system in the UK is a mess, both for public and private workers, it is one reason why I can't transfer my Australian supper fund to the UK because the Aus Government think the Pension system is a DUD, they would be right in saying that, you know that most people will need more than 500,000 in a fund to live a respectful life by the time they finish work for good, the private sector needs more Governance, and all workers should be putting aside 10% of their anual salary, by law, No need for the NI system then, companies in Aus have to by law pay in to a supper fun from the day you start work of around 3.5% you match that and the Gov will also do the same, and that is what the UK Gov should be sorting out here.

I am so Glad that all my funds are in Aus, not here, and by the way I can also self manage them to, all I have to do is log on to my account right here in the UK and say were all my money is invested, by %, so you take your own risk, if you want, and I can add more funds in to the Pot to when I want.

That How It Should Be Done Here In The UK.

peely wrote:
How can people in the private sector do anything about their pensions ? the answer - we cant because we live in the real world > when markets /investments go up then so do our pensions , and when they fall so do our pensions. We cant all have a public subsidised money pot waiting for us when we retire and certainly not in our fifties . and yes we pay into them as well - you dont know lucky you are !! You want to wake up and come into the real world ! you should be ashamed !!!

Peely, you ain’t got a clue! You wouldn’t know the real world if it bit you on the a$$!

I don’t know one person I work with who’s going to retire in their 50’s. It’s a lie made up by people like you in a feeble attempt to justify your jealousy. The only people that could actually retire at this age are the heads of service and the directors; people like Graham Burgess.

These people are not idiots, they manage budgets that run it the tens of millions and are ultimately responsible for the social, environmental and educational welfare of the whole population of the borough.

Have you actually spoken to them?

I have, and believe me, these are really intelligent people. When you start discussing their service areas, you know that they are doing a good job under difficult circumstances. The are well trained, and dedicated to making this town liveable and you only get this calibre of staff if you pay them enough. This idea of paying ‘good wages for good staff’ then filters down in responsibility, wage, and pension contributions until we get to the people who clean the toilets.

Personally, I spend a lot more time sat on the toilet than I do talking to Graham, so I appreciate the cleaners work a lot more!

I also think a decent wage for the cleaner, along with an ok pension for 45 years of doing a good job, is not too much to ask.

Of course, you being blind to reality, wouldn’t know that would you?

All part of our very Broken Society, I'm afraid to say.

Will - Ash wrote:
Poor kids...

There is no support for these strikes... A bunch of pathetic public sector workers thinking they deserve more!

Try working in the private sector!!

The only redeeming feature is that only 25% of the public sector support these strikes...

The other 75% have got sense!!

I worked for many years in the private sector and have seen my hard earned pension struggle to grow in recent years. I moved to a public sector job 8 years ago and hoped to retire at 60. Under the proposed new scheme I will have to work another 5 years and not be rewarded with any extra pension. Is that right?

My sister is in here 50's she has just retired on a nice big pension ....... where did she work ? THE NHS.

pensions in the private section use to be very good untill it was found that there would be a very very big hole in the fund when everyone needed to draw on it, and yes I have one of those pensions but was only able to pay in for 6 yrs and yes I drew it when I reached 50 I have one of the "new" pvt pensions which I also draw (it was frozen when Mr Blair/Brown refused to help the textile industry and I was made redundant) that pension I was in for 12 yrs and pays less than half the other one, my present pension I shall be in for 18 yrs and that is the same it will pay less than my original one. It would have been very nice to have all my pensions pay at the same rate ie the same as the public pensions but then the public sector would not fill the big hole, but the private sector must fill the public sectors even bigger hole.
So please JD dont give me the sob story that nobody retires in their 50@s from the public sector because it is just not true and you know it to be so.
Lets be blunt the private sector does not want to employ people that have worked in the public sector because most are seen to be lazy and nick named sick note, that brings down those that do and want to work but is that not the case in every thing we do.

Hold on a minute BG and lets have a look at the situation.

First of all, this sister of yours; lets have a few more details please.
For example, if she was 59 and she had worked in the NHS since she was 19, she would get a pension for the 40 years of service she put in. Now that is a long time to be working for one company, you’ll agree. You also fail to mention HOW MUCH she is getting paid for retiring before she was 60. Have her payments been cut because of this? Has she retired early through poor health? Finally, what job did she do? Was she emptying bins, or a ward sister, or a manager? All important factors needed to justify your little whimsy.

As for being lazy sick notes. This is just a biased, jealous opinion on your part. It’s obvious to anyone with half a brain that a lot of public sector workers come into contact with lots of other people and therefore more likely to contract coughs and colds. You will also find a higher percentage of public sector workers employed in poorer parts the country, which statically have a lower life expectancy. It is therefore easy to hypothesise that these same people are statistically more likely to be off work than private sector employees. This can be justified by the fact that staff that come into contact with the public are being offered flu jabs in the next few months.

It wasn’t the public sector that made you redundant but CAPITALIST market forces (and this explains your bitterness and hatred for others I take it?)

As for the public sector pension hole. Who’s fault is that? The workers or the government for not sorting it out sooner? If you truly answer that as the workers fault; for just getting a council job in a town with high unemployment, then you really a sad individual.

Kinda puts your B* S* into place BG.

As a public sector worker, I currently pay 6.5 % of my wage into the pension fund. I have just calculated my entitlement based on the current scheme on the official LGPS website. I will come out at age 65 with a pension of less than half my £20,000 a year wage and a lump sum of around £6,000. Any way you look at it that isn't gold plated, it doesn't even make the minimum wage.
If these proposals are adopted, I will see my contributions arise to 10% of my wage, I will be expected to work until at least 68 (it will probably have gone up again by then) and because the way the calculation is made will change, my pension will be worth at least 16% less at retirement than under current conditions.
For me (and the vast majority of my colleagues) it is a lose / lose situation.
According to another respected (non union) Pensions web site, the average Private Pension contribution is just under 10%. There are around 53,000 such schemes currently running in the UK.
A well known example is the BAE final salary scheme into which employees pay in a minimum of 4% of their salary.
I'm not saying things are perfect or that there doesn't have to be change, but why are we villified for fighting something that is likely to leave the majority of us struggling to survive when we retire just because we happen to work for the tax payer? Would the same level of vitriol be directed at BAE staff if they went on strike about their pension scheme being changed?
Yes, many people in the private sector don't have employer pension schemes: what is to stop you paying 10% of your salary into a pension scheme? We do.
Our pension funds were solvent until the government told the councils etc that they could spend them to give the appearance that the government was solvent.
Yes, of course we can resign and get a job somewhere else and pay our contributions into a private sector pension if you want, but are you going to volunteer to fight fires / educate the children / empty the bins / fix the roads / work in the hospitals when we have taken your advice?
Didn't think so.....

Divide and conquer.....thats the Coalition's goal. Set the screwed private sector workers against the soon to be screwed public sector workers. The net result...we all end up with inadequate pensions. Private sector workers should fight for better pensions and support public sector workers in their fight. This race to the bottom will benefit ONLY the rich. Are you rich?

Can a teacher please explain why as parents we are told we cannot take our children out of school during term due to the effect it will have on our children's education. But when teachers strike, it is perfectly acceptable for children to miss a day of their education.

Having just received notice from my son's secondary school that they will be closed next week. Can a teacher please explain who is going to pay me the day's personal holiday I had left, which I had previously booked for a medical appointment and now will have to take a day's unpaid leave.

Can someone in the NHS please explain why they think postponing an appointment, due to strike action, for someone in chronic pain is acceptable. But when a member of the public misses an appointment the statistics are paraded in every waiting room about the number of missed appointments.

Specific answers rather than blurb about the 'right to strike' would be appreciated.

DougFlo wrote:
Can a teacher please explain why as parents we are told we cannot take our children out of school during term due to the effect it will have on our children's education. But when teachers strike, it is perfectly acceptable for children to miss a day of their education. Having just received notice from my son's secondary school that they will be closed next week. Can a teacher please explain who is going to pay me the day's personal holiday I had left, which I had previously booked for a medical appointment and now will have to take a day's unpaid leave. Can someone in the NHS please explain why they think postponing an appointment, due to strike action, for someone in chronic pain is acceptable. But when a member of the public misses an appointment the statistics are paraded in every waiting room about the number of missed appointments. Specific answers rather than blurb about the 'right to strike' would be appreciated.

I'd say that if you have to take a day off because your son's school has closed, you need to 'man up'.

He's at least eleven for Gods sake, he can look after himself.

If he goes to special school however, you should be thanking the staff that work tirelessly at supporting your son and consider the fact they may deserve their pension after all.

Either way, that answers that one..

jack daniels wrote:

DougFlo wrote:
Can a teacher please explain why as parents we are told we cannot take our children out of school during term due to the effect it will have on our children's education. But when teachers strike, it is perfectly acceptable for children to miss a day of their education. Having just received notice from my son's secondary school that they will be closed next week. Can a teacher please explain who is going to pay me the day's personal holiday I had left, which I had previously booked for a medical appointment and now will have to take a day's unpaid leave. Can someone in the NHS please explain why they think postponing an appointment, due to strike action, for someone in chronic pain is acceptable. But when a member of the public misses an appointment the statistics are paraded in every waiting room about the number of missed appointments. Specific answers rather than blurb about the 'right to strike' would be appreciated.

I'd say that if you have to take a day off because your son's school has closed, you need to 'man up'.

He's at least eleven for Gods sake, he can look after himself.

If he goes to special school however, you should be thanking the staff that work tirelessly at supporting your son and consider the fact they may deserve their pension after all.

Either way, that answers that one..

Official advice states:

The most important factor to consider is how mature the child is. For example, it may be okay to leave a mature 12 year old alone, but not a 13 year old who is not mature.
The National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children (NSPCC) advises that:
children under the age of about 12 are rarely mature enough to be left alone for a long period of time.

...or just 'man up'....thanks for the quality advice.

DougFlo wrote:

jack daniels wrote:

DougFlo wrote: Can a teacher please explain why as parents we are told we cannot take our children out of school during term due to the effect it will have on our children's education. But when teachers strike, it is perfectly acceptable for children to miss a day of their education. Having just received notice from my son's secondary school that they will be closed next week. Can a teacher please explain who is going to pay me the day's personal holiday I had left, which I had previously booked for a medical appointment and now will have to take a day's unpaid leave. Can someone in the NHS please explain why they think postponing an appointment, due to strike action, for someone in chronic pain is acceptable. But when a member of the public misses an appointment the statistics are paraded in every waiting room about the number of missed appointments. Specific answers rather than blurb about the 'right to strike' would be appreciated.

I'd say that if you have to take a day off because your son's school has closed, you need to 'man up'. He's at least eleven for Gods sake, he can look after himself. If he goes to special school however, you should be thanking the staff that work tirelessly at supporting your son and consider the fact they may deserve their pension after all. Either way, that answers that one..

Official advice states: The most important factor to consider is how mature the child is. For example, it may be okay to leave a mature 12 year old alone, but not a 13 year old who is not mature. The National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children (NSPCC) advises that: children under the age of about 12 are rarely mature enough to be left alone for a long period of time. ...or just 'man up'....thanks for the quality advice.

The funniest thing is that the ‘official advice’ you are referring to will probably be collated by same public sector staff that you are complaining about.

I wouldn’t worry about it to be honest, the Children’s safe guarding team will be on strike, along with all the teachers.

DougFlo wrote:
Can a teacher please explain why as parents we are told we cannot take our children out of school during term due to the effect it will have on our children's education. But when teachers strike, it is perfectly acceptable for children to miss a day of their education. Having just received notice from my son's secondary school that they will be closed next week. Can a teacher please explain who is going to pay me the day's personal holiday I had left, which I had previously booked for a medical appointment and now will have to take a day's unpaid leave. Can someone in the NHS please explain why they think postponing an appointment, due to strike action, for someone in chronic pain is acceptable. But when a member of the public misses an appointment the statistics are paraded in every waiting room about the number of missed appointments. Specific answers rather than blurb about the 'right to strike' would be appreciated.

When the teachers go on strike for ten or more working days a year as often as possible during your child's education I will respond to your nonsense. Likewise with the NHS: when the number of postponed appointments due to strike action equals the number of missed / wasted appts by people who can't be bothered showing up I will respond to that.

I have a child in reception class and have to take the day off work to look after him. This is either unpaid or a day off my holiday entitlement. They are several other workers at my place of employment in the same boat. Is this right that i should lose a days pay when i need ever penny to make ends meet? I agree that they have the right to make a stand but why strike forcing thousands of parents to lose money, why not organise a protest or march whatever during the school holidays? Also something i don't understand if someone can answer are they forced to pay into this pension or can they opt out and arrange their own therfore paying as much or little into it as they please? Nor right up on pensions as i can't afford to pay into one!

Rather than re-quote you (jd) I will save the space but you are full of contradictions:

I fully respect the service we get from teachers, school staff and NHS staff. I also respect the service I get from people who work just as hard in the private sector. We need them both for the country to run effectively.

You will note that I consider their advice and experience to be worthy of notice.

I do not respect them when they advise us to behave in a particular way, but do not support the advice with their own actions.

If you can bring yourself to actually answer the questions I originally posed, then I will listen.

ladysal wrote:

DougFlo wrote:
Can a teacher please explain why as parents we are told we cannot take our children out of school during term due to the effect it will have on our children's education. But when teachers strike, it is perfectly acceptable for children to miss a day of their education. Having just received notice from my son's secondary school that they will be closed next week. Can a teacher please explain who is going to pay me the day's personal holiday I had left, which I had previously booked for a medical appointment and now will have to take a day's unpaid leave. Can someone in the NHS please explain why they think postponing an appointment, due to strike action, for someone in chronic pain is acceptable. But when a member of the public misses an appointment the statistics are paraded in every waiting room about the number of missed appointments. Specific answers rather than blurb about the 'right to strike' would be appreciated.

When the teachers go on strike for ten or more working days a year as often as possible during your child's education I will respond to your nonsense. Likewise with the NHS: when the number of postponed appointments due to strike action equals the number of missed / wasted appts by people who can't be bothered showing up I will respond to that.

Again, no actual answers.

I have never taken my children out of school during term time, because I respect the advice given to me by teachers and headteachers over the years. Your retort that it is only wrong if the teachers strike for more than 10 days makes no sense at all.

No specific response to my NHS question either, just excuses.

DougFlo wrote:

ladysal wrote:

DougFlo wrote: Can a teacher please explain why as parents we are told we cannot take our children out of school during term due to the effect it will have on our children's education. But when teachers strike, it is perfectly acceptable for children to miss a day of their education. Having just received notice from my son's secondary school that they will be closed next week. Can a teacher please explain who is going to pay me the day's personal holiday I had left, which I had previously booked for a medical appointment and now will have to take a day's unpaid leave. Can someone in the NHS please explain why they think postponing an appointment, due to strike action, for someone in chronic pain is acceptable. But when a member of the public misses an appointment the statistics are paraded in every waiting room about the number of missed appointments. Specific answers rather than blurb about the 'right to strike' would be appreciated.

When the teachers go on strike for ten or more working days a year as often as possible during your child's education I will respond to your nonsense. Likewise with the NHS: when the number of postponed appointments due to strike action equals the number of missed / wasted appts by people who can't be bothered showing up I will respond to that.

Again, no actual answers. I have never taken my children out of school during term time, because I respect the advice given to me by teachers and headteachers over the years. Your retort that it is only wrong if the teachers strike for more than 10 days makes no sense at all. No specific response to my NHS question either, just excuses.

No it wouldn't do because you obviously AREN'T one of the parents who do it. Likewise you obviously aren't one of the many who waste those appointment times.
If you can't deal with answers that look at the wider picture you will be waiting a very long time.....

Nobody would say it was acceptable for strike action to mean an NHS appt was postponed having worked in public services for 20+ years I can't remember it ever happening during my working life (within the NHS that is). The fact that they are doing it now should tell you how much this means to the people going on strike.

DougFlo; when the question makes sense and isn't an

Milano; good comment about how teachers should strike during holidays, but surely the ponit of a strike is to cause maximum disruption? What use would it be if it didn't affect anything?

I understand the wider picture but disagree with the process being used to attempt to resolve the grievance and the effect it has on children, parents and patients.

You follow a career path with terms, conditions and a contract and are honour (and legally) bound to stick to it !
How has your employer the right to dis-honour his obligations ?
The moaning and whinging on these posts shows the essential service you provide.
Lack of Public approval for your action puts more pressure on the government and therefore strengthens your hand.

You are being made to be the solution to all the government's problems

Newsflash - teachers aren't there to 'look after' children throughout the working day; they are there to educate them. If you choose to have children then it is your responsibility to care for them / pay for them to be cared for when school happens to be closed for one reason or another. A school isn't a babysitting service, if it was there'd be no pensions crisis because they'd be able to charge!

woodyads wrote:
Newsflash - teachers aren't there to 'look after' children throughout the working day; they are there to educate them. If you choose to have children then it is your responsibility to care for them / pay for them to be cared for when school happens to be closed for one reason or another. A school isn't a babysitting service, if it was there'd be no pensions crisis because they'd be able to charge!

I was half way through replying to your post, but just couldn't be bothered. I cannot see where anyone has suggested that teachers are there to 'look after' children. We want teachers to educate, rather than strike during term time. Have a strike in the middle of summer perhaps! See how well that goes down.

DougFlo wrote:

woodyads wrote:
Newsflash - teachers aren't there to 'look after' children throughout the working day; they are there to educate them. If you choose to have children then it is your responsibility to care for them / pay for them to be cared for when school happens to be closed for one reason or another. A school isn't a babysitting service, if it was there'd be no pensions crisis because they'd be able to charge!

I was half way through replying to your post, but just couldn't be bothered. I cannot see where anyone has suggested that teachers are there to 'look after' children. We want teachers to educate, rather than strike during term time. Have a strike in the middle of summer perhaps! See how well that goes down.

A number of comments have complained about 'who will look after the children on Wednesday?', which prompted my comment. And the whole point of a strike, and this one in particular is that they are coordinated to cause as much disruption as possible. Why do you think British Airways always strike at August Bank Holiday, or other ridiculously busy times? Forcing school closures when they are already closed in the holidays wouldn't be very productive, now would it?

Society as we know it wouldn't exist without the public sector.

But it should be obvious to all that the pensions system as it stands is no longer sustainable.

It would not surprise me to learn that a lot of the people who are posting negative comments about the proposed strike were already retired. It is really easy to support both governments and legislation when neither will harm your lifestyle or plans you have laid down for your future. Why are people ready to rally against individuals who are in a position to stand up to abuses of working conditions? Such people would have criticised, the Tolpuddle martyrs, the Chartists and the Jarrow marchers etc. They are happy to remain in their comfortable bubbles whilst everything falls apart around them. For the record I am an agency worker and therefore do not benefit from directly from this action. However, I do understand divide and rule and as with previous industries if somebody else does not fight we will all be the worse off.

I have no sympathy whatsoever. It is time thewse people got a taste of reality and realised thedy are the same as the rest of us. They are not special. Understand????

I have no sympathy whatsoever. It is time these people got a taste of reality and realised thedy are the same as the rest of us. They are not special. Understand????

Will - Ash wrote:
Poor kids... There is no support for these strikes... A bunch of pathetic public sector workers thinking they deserve more! Try working in the private sector!! The only redeeming feature is that only 25% of the public sector support these strikes... The other 75% have got sense!!

Couldn't agree more.

Welcome to the real world.

This has been going on for years in the private sector, closure of final salary pension schemes, higher contributions, work longer.

Public sector workers - your cushy number is over. If you don't like it try working somewhere else.

CAG1 wrote:

Will - Ash wrote: Poor kids... There is no support for these strikes... A bunch of pathetic public sector workers thinking they deserve more! Try working in the private sector!! The only redeeming feature is that only 25% of the public sector support these strikes... The other 75% have got sense!!

Couldn't agree more. Welcome to the real world. This has been going on for years in the private sector, closure of final salary pension schemes, higher contributions, work longer. Public sector workers - your cushy number is over. If you don't like it try working somewhere else.

The fact that it has been going on in the private sector doesn't make it right. Did it happen to you? Did you sit back and let it or did you go on strike / take industrial action / complain about it at every opportunity?

I keep asking this and never get a sensible answer: why, just because we work for the public sector and do all the jobs you need us to do, whether it is education, road sweeping, care of the elderly, nursing, emergency care , emptying the bins, are we expected to sit back and take it whe our pay and conditions are altered for the worse? Why does the fact that we work for you the tax payer mean that we are not allowed to exercise our industrial rights when it comes to objecting to these changes? If it was happening to you andyou worked for a private company, would everyone be telling you to stop complaining and live with it?

ladysal wrote:

CAG1 wrote:

Will - Ash wrote: Poor kids... There is no support for these strikes... A bunch of pathetic public sector workers thinking they deserve more! Try working in the private sector!! The only redeeming feature is that only 25% of the public sector support these strikes... The other 75% have got sense!!

Couldn't agree more. Welcome to the real world. This has been going on for years in the private sector, closure of final salary pension schemes, higher contributions, work longer. Public sector workers - your cushy number is over. If you don't like it try working somewhere else.

The fact that it has been going on in the private sector doesn't make it right. Did it happen to you? Did you sit back and let it or did you go on strike / take industrial action / complain about it at every opportunity? I keep asking this and never get a sensible answer: why, just because we work for the public sector and do all the jobs you need us to do, whether it is education, road sweeping, care of the elderly, nursing, emergency care , emptying the bins, are we expected to sit back and take it whe our pay and conditions are altered for the worse? Why does the fact that we work for you the tax payer mean that we are not allowed to exercise our industrial rights when it comes to objecting to these changes? If it was happening to you andyou worked for a private company, would everyone be telling you to stop complaining and live with it?

Yes it has happened to me including redudancy.

No one said it's right, but it's a fact people are getting living longer and final salary pension schemes are not sustainable. So how do you want to fund this? And don't say tax payers.

Like I say, if you don't like it go and work somewhere else. I'd like to see if you can get the same terms and conditions you have in the public sector in the private sector.

If the private sector went on strike companies would go bust (unlike public sector organisations).

Since 2007, teachers have been paying more for their pensions and the retirement age has already been raised to 65. The changes agreed then ensured that teachers’ pensions ARE sustainable and affordable and the figures in Lord Hutton’s report confirm this.

And as for striking teachers VERY rarely strike. The right-wing media try to convince us that they are militants striking all of the time. But, in over thirty years teaching I took less than five days off due to strike action. In over 30 years. Not exactly excessive is it?

Oh, and over those 30-odd years I paid into my pension as did my employers with whom I had an agreement re pension rights. And, having taught for most of those 30-odd years with MS, taking very little time off because of it, then I think just maybe I DO deserve my pension - which isn't gold-plated.

All of you people who are criticising public sector workers are being manipulated by the government. You should not be arguing for a lowering of employment conditions for others you should be arguing for better conditions for all sectors of the workforce.

Remember, the government just twelve months ago were stating that Britain did not need the public sector and dismissed them as surplus to requirements. However, now a strike is imminent they are basically saying that the people they once stated were ineffectual are now crucial to the economy and are holding the country to ransom. With regard to so many people not working on Wednesday I would also ask you to remember that this strike is only for one day and the government has had plenty of time to prepare for it. What we are witnessing is the government doing nothing in order to maximise the hardship felt by the population and as a result generate animosity towards those who are striking. Remember on the 29th of April this year the government gave everyone the day off for the royal wedding, did the economy descend into chaos as a result of this? No, because in this instance the government actually created contingency plans which dealt with the problems created by their largesse. Who do you think paid for the nation's extra bank holiday.

Walsh wrote:
All of you people who are criticising public sector workers are being manipulated by the government. You should not be arguing for a lowering of employment conditions for others you should be arguing for better conditions for all sectors of the workforce.

Remember, the government just twelve months ago were stating that Britain did not need the public sector and dismissed them as surplus to requirements. However, now a strike is imminent they are basically saying that the people they once stated were ineffectual are now crucial to the economy and are holding the country to ransom. With regard to so many people not working on Wednesday I would also ask you to remember that this strike is only for one day and the government has had plenty of time to prepare for it. What we are witnessing is the government doing nothing in order to maximise the hardship felt by the population and as a result generate animosity towards those who are striking. Remember on the 29th of April this year the government gave everyone the day off for the royal wedding, did the economy descend into chaos as a result of this? No, because in this instance the government actually created contingency plans which dealt with the problems created by their largesse. Who do you think paid for the nation's extra bank holiday.

Everybody even the government are being robbed by the larcenists who control the banks and stock price shares.Infact the larcenists control all of humanity.Welcome to the New World Order public sector workers or should we say public sector attenders now and again.I've never seen a public sector worker break into a sweat while attending the public.
'just a thought'
Its an hard life for them..'bless'..hope
the blackmailing works out for all
those rushed off their feet public sector thingys...

Not read much of the comments, bar one the first five just showed what a bunch of numpties were going to comment.
I want to know if those that are not striking will actually refuse to accept any improved offer. Work longer than agreed, put in more than agreed and take out less than agreeed...... nah I'm not striking, I will just bend over and.....
Then they will wonder in twenty years why many people are retired without a pension............

CapitaBackHander wrote:
Not read much of the comments, bar one the first five just showed what a bunch of numpties were going to comment.
I want to know if those that are not striking will actually refuse to accept any improved offer. Work longer than agreed, put in more than agreed and take out less than agreeed...... nah I'm not striking, I will just bend over and.....
Then they will wonder in twenty years why many people are retired without a pension............

It's OK dismissing people as numpties, but who is going to pay for the pensions of the future?

"Will those not striking refuse to accept an improved offer...?"
There isn't going to be an improved offer! The country is almost bankrupt!

If Public sector pensions were entirely funded by their own contributions, they would have my support, but they are not.
The kids are more important than the teachers. The patients are more important than the nurses. What goes round WILL come round.

I blame Steve Kean

To all of you who think that public sector workers do not work hard you live in "cuckoo land". As a primary teacher my daughter worked 80 hours per week. She was in school for 8am and left at 6pm. It was a struggle to find time to eat lunch as she had so much preparation to do in the shape of planning and preparing and paying for all her resources. She came home and worked for another 4 hours every night preparing for the following day and marking. She had one evening off per week and that was Friday. She then worked most of the weekend also. During the holidays she had to go in to prepare the classroom by putting up displays, again mostly paid for by herself, moving furniture and also had more planning to do.
Before teaching she worked in the Private Sector and went in to work at 9am and finished at 5pm and then the rest was her own time.
So before you comment about teachers get your facts straight. She has now left teaching as a lot of people do as it is far easier in the private sector!!

happycyclist wrote:

CapitaBackHander wrote:
Not read much of the comments, bar one the first five just showed what a bunch of numpties were going to comment.
I want to know if those that are not striking will actually refuse to accept any improved offer. Work longer than agreed, put in more than agreed and take out less than agreeed...... nah I'm not striking, I will just bend over and.....
Then they will wonder in twenty years why many people are retired without a pension............

It's OK dismissing people as numpties, but who is going to pay for the pensions of the future?

"Will those not striking refuse to accept an improved offer...?"
There isn't going to be an improved offer! The country is almost bankrupt!

no improved offer going to any of the strikers.
THE LARCENISTS HAVE TOOK IT......
GET REAL F.F.Sake

not too old to care wrote:
If Public sector pensions were entirely funded by their own contributions, they would have my support, but they are not. The kids are more important than the teachers. The patients are more important than the nurses. What goes round WILL come round.

Yes, but if you don't treat the teachers well, you will have a nation of un-educated people and there won't be any patients because they will all have died due to a lack of nursing care.....
What you and all others like you seem to forget is that as tax payers you are our employers!! Lets go the whole hog and privatise the public sector then you can have what you want..... No? Didn't think so.

i dont know the ins and outs regarding the pensions or reasons for the strike but one thing i do know for sure is the kids are off on wednesday then back for a couple of weeks then its christmas then that will be extended for a few days because of a bit of snow and ice, then guess what? when they do finally get back to school some time in the new year it will be a teacher training day so another day off.. LOL.. :)

Try reading my last comment Darwenbert before you comment about teachers.

banksider wrote:
Since 2007, teachers have been paying more for their pensions and the retirement age has already been raised to 65. The changes agreed then ensured that teachers’ pensions ARE sustainable and affordable and the figures in Lord Hutton’s report confirm this.

And as for striking teachers VERY rarely strike. The right-wing media try to convince us that they are militants striking all of the time. But, in over thirty years teaching I took less than five days off due to strike action. In over 30 years. Not exactly excessive is it?

Oh, and over those 30-odd years I paid into my pension as did my employers with whom I had an agreement re pension rights. And, having taught for most of those 30-odd years with MS, taking very little time off because of it, then I think just maybe I DO deserve my pension - which isn't gold-plated.

Brilliant - if the pensions are sustainable and affordable, please can you start campaigning to have them detached from tax payer responsibility.

Everyone will be happy then, especially those poor suckers who have no pension themselves but are forced to pay someone elses.

Why are public sector workers not screaming out for this to happen?

ladysal wrote:

CAG1 wrote:

Will - Ash wrote: Poor kids... There is no support for these strikes... A bunch of pathetic public sector workers thinking they deserve more! Try working in the private sector!! The only redeeming feature is that only 25% of the public sector support these strikes... The other 75% have got sense!!

Couldn't agree more. Welcome to the real world. This has been going on for years in the private sector, closure of final salary pension schemes, higher contributions, work longer. Public sector workers - your cushy number is over. If you don't like it try working somewhere else.

The fact that it has been going on in the private sector doesn't make it right. Did it happen to you? Did you sit back and let it or did you go on strike / take industrial action / complain about it at every opportunity?

I keep asking this and never get a sensible answer: why, just because we work for the public sector and do all the jobs you need us to do, whether it is education, road sweeping, care of the elderly, nursing, emergency care , emptying the bins, are we expected to sit back and take it whe our pay and conditions are altered for the worse? Why does the fact that we work for you the tax payer mean that we are not allowed to exercise our industrial rights when it comes to objecting to these changes? If it was happening to you andyou worked for a private company, would everyone be telling you to stop complaining and live with it?

It happened because everyone else had to live in the real world. Pensions with a limitless pot of money is not living in the real world.

It is supremely selfish of public sector workers, already on higher than average pay than the private sector, to expect already skint people to continually pay for something so grossly unfair.

The public sector workers are acting just like the bankers - greedy selfish pigs who just expect everyone else to pay.

Why should people with no pension pay stupid money they can't afford for completely bloated and unsustainable pensions for someone else.

How unbelievably selfish. Piggies with their noses firmly in the trough.

ladysal wrote:

not too old to care wrote:
If Public sector pensions were entirely funded by their own contributions, they would have my support, but they are not. The kids are more important than the teachers. The patients are more important than the nurses. What goes round WILL come round.

Yes, but if you don't treat the teachers well, you will have a nation of un-educated people and there won't be any patients because they will all have died due to a lack of nursing care.....
What you and all others like you seem to forget is that as tax payers you are our employers!! Lets go the whole hog and privatise the public sector then you can have what you want..... No? Didn't think so.

You are absolutely right - tax payers are your employers.

They suddenly want fairness and value for money too. They don't want to be continually paying for someone else's pension. How is that fair?

Pensions should definitely be funded by their own contributions. It's supremely selfish if it is anything else.

Don't make me laugh that you think all the best workers in this country are teachers. They clearly aren't.

My wife's union trumpeted 80% support as mandte for the withdrawal of labour today. What they failed to add was that only 23% of members oed. In other words many people have been inconvenienced today beause less than one in five of a unon membership actually wanted to go on strike.

This only serves to underline the perception that union leaders are totally out of touch with the modern economic climate and the plight of the vast majority of private sector employees whose pension funds have been systematically plundered over a long period.