Lancashire TelegraphSpeed action meeting over Darwen death crash site (From Lancashire Telegraph)

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Speed action meeting over Darwen death crash site

Lancashire Telegraph: Residents are concerned about safety at Bull Hill Residents are concerned about safety at Bull Hill

A MEETING to discuss ways to stop speeding at a Darwen death crash site will take place this week.

Four people died in two separate car accidents in October 2011 and April this year at Bull Hill, leading to questions over whether the road was safe.

And in November last year, Whitehall councillor David Foster called for action at the site — a regular spot for speeding drivers.

The meeting will be held at Bolton Road United Reformed Church from 7pm on Thursday, with police, council officials and residents all invited to give their views.

It comes two weeks after an inquest into the death of Jack Eatock, of Astley, Greater Manchester, who died in an accident in April.

The road has a 30mph speed limit heading out of Darwen until Woodlea Chase, when it rises to 50mph.

But concerns have been raised that slowing down from 50mph to 30mph on the approach to Darwen is difficult.

Coun Foster said: “We have the police and some people from Capita coming. I don’t think we will ever solve the problem as there is no magical formula to stop speeding.But hopefully we can come up with some way of alleviating the problem.”

Coun Foster said he had been trying to get the council to take measures at the site for some time.

He said: “I did want to get repeater signs to remind people of the speed limit, but apparently you can’t get them for 30mph limits.

“I have also tried to get the council to put up electronic warning signs that warn people when they are over the limit.

“It is a problem on that stretch. I know from the amount of times I get overtaken.

“It used to be a 40mph limit but it was reduced after residents comp-lained, but it is a continuing problem.”

Comments (19)

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7:24pm Mon 26 Nov 12

foxy lass says...

Most of the drivers just keep going at 50mph until they hit the speed camera on Bolton Rd. Im not a fan of cameras, but maybe thats the only solution.
Most of the drivers just keep going at 50mph until they hit the speed camera on Bolton Rd. Im not a fan of cameras, but maybe thats the only solution. foxy lass
  • Score: 2

8:42pm Mon 26 Nov 12

s_smith says...

Perhaps the more pertinent question is: why is it 30mph in the first place?
.
It isn't a built-up area, and clearly the road is telling people that a speed above 30mph is safe (which it is) so why not just put it back to 40mph as it should be. That way, perhaps people will respect the 30mph limit near the cemetery.
.
All the council have to do is look at all the research in to the matter of I inappropriately low speed limits and the negative effect they have on vehicle speed and road safety in general.
Perhaps the more pertinent question is: why is it 30mph in the first place? . It isn't a built-up area, and clearly the road is telling people that a speed above 30mph is safe (which it is) so why not just put it back to 40mph as it should be. That way, perhaps people will respect the 30mph limit near the cemetery. . All the council have to do is look at all the research in to the matter of I inappropriately low speed limits and the negative effect they have on vehicle speed and road safety in general. s_smith
  • Score: 1

9:13pm Mon 26 Nov 12

Darrens Delivery Service says...

Judge Nic Sanders wrote:
The drivers were high on Cocaine and alcohol. Highway Code out of the window there
Fair comment. Gatso and big speed humps. Although if one has drank to much or on drugs, will not make one bit of difference. Sad state of affairs really.

Any-one any other suggestions?
[quote][p][bold]Judge Nic Sanders[/bold] wrote: The drivers were high on Cocaine and alcohol. Highway Code out of the window there[/p][/quote]Fair comment. Gatso and big speed humps. Although if one has drank to much or on drugs, will not make one bit of difference. Sad state of affairs really. Any-one any other suggestions? Darrens Delivery Service
  • Score: 2

9:26pm Mon 26 Nov 12

MerlinTheVoiceofReason2 says...

"But concerns have been raised that slowing down from 50mph to 30mph on the approach to Darwen is difficult." Why? Have people not heard of brakes or taking one's foot off the accelerator? There is a 50 to 30 and back to 50 stretch on the A59 at Osbaldeston which doesn't seem to cause any problems - but there is a speed camera there.
"But concerns have been raised that slowing down from 50mph to 30mph on the approach to Darwen is difficult." Why? Have people not heard of brakes or taking one's foot off the accelerator? There is a 50 to 30 and back to 50 stretch on the A59 at Osbaldeston which doesn't seem to cause any problems - but there is a speed camera there. MerlinTheVoiceofReason2
  • Score: 1

11:12pm Mon 26 Nov 12

peely says...

The road never killed anyone , it's stupid drivers. Just slow down, don't blame the road it's just an easy way out, still if you're high on drugs or half pi$$ed common sense goes out the window !
The road never killed anyone , it's stupid drivers. Just slow down, don't blame the road it's just an easy way out, still if you're high on drugs or half pi$$ed common sense goes out the window ! peely
  • Score: 3

12:01am Tue 27 Nov 12

MUDDLES says...

Every road is dangerous.....it's the drivers themselves who make the mistakes...i travel that road on a regular basis,and the amount of stupidity is beyond belief.
Every road is dangerous.....it's the drivers themselves who make the mistakes...i travel that road on a regular basis,and the amount of stupidity is beyond belief. MUDDLES
  • Score: 2

12:33am Tue 27 Nov 12

HILLBILLYBOB says...

Other areas seem to have sufficient funding for the 'average speed' cameras.
Surely this would be a solution to slow down the traffic from Bull Hill to at least the town centre.
Chicanes & rumble strips will only give the boy-racers more attraction to speed.
Other areas seem to have sufficient funding for the 'average speed' cameras. Surely this would be a solution to slow down the traffic from Bull Hill to at least the town centre. Chicanes & rumble strips will only give the boy-racers more attraction to speed. HILLBILLYBOB
  • Score: 0

7:36am Tue 27 Nov 12

ray_carlings_moustache says...

"A driver was three times over the legal drink drive limit and had taken cocaine.Jack had bought some cigarettes and was messing around in the door looking for a lighter. He didn’t have his seatbelt on as he was still mucking about in the door. Senior accident investigator PC Richard Roberts also told the inquest the car could have been travelling at up to 90mph, where the speed limit is 50mph." Yep, definately the road's fault.
"A driver was three times over the legal drink drive limit and had taken cocaine.Jack had bought some cigarettes and was messing around in the door looking for a lighter. He didn’t have his seatbelt on as he was still mucking about in the door. Senior accident investigator PC Richard Roberts also told the inquest the car could have been travelling at up to 90mph, where the speed limit is 50mph." Yep, definately the road's fault. ray_carlings_moustache
  • Score: 5

7:56am Tue 27 Nov 12

A Darener says...

foxy lass wrote:
Most of the drivers just keep going at 50mph until they hit the speed camera on Bolton Rd. Im not a fan of cameras, but maybe thats the only solution.
If they hit the speed camera then perhaps it should be resited!
[quote][p][bold]foxy lass[/bold] wrote: Most of the drivers just keep going at 50mph until they hit the speed camera on Bolton Rd. Im not a fan of cameras, but maybe thats the only solution.[/p][/quote]If they hit the speed camera then perhaps it should be resited! A Darener
  • Score: 1

8:12am Tue 27 Nov 12

EX-Pat Local Man says...

The configuration of this road has always meant people will speed. I learnt to drive in 1979 with my father and grandfather, we often travelled this road (the A666) past Bull Hill Maternity home then, and folk were speeding way back then. All too often these people have little regard for themselves or other peoples safety, give a boy a big toy and he will use it to the extreme. For as long as I can remember people have been banging on about the speed limit on this road. The current limits are fine, it’s the drivers that want educating, educating of the dangers of speed. You only need to look at the dry stone walling that boundaries the road, how many times has this been repaired over the last 30 years, oodles of times. I hate speed cameras, they are just a government cash cow in my opinion, but on this occasion this road needs a couple at least. As the Whitehall council said, flashing speed restriction signs, (but they can’t get them – utter cobblers – I can give you the name of a company that will make them to any specification), visible warning deterrents do work.
Many years ago in another life, I ran a successful road safety campaign in the run up to Christmas about the dangers of drunk driving. We positioned smashed cars in various places along a problem road, not dissimilar to Bull Hill. Cars that had been involved in fatal crashes, with dummy’s hanging out of windows and such like, (sure you can picture this scene) blood and gore…….. It worked, shock factor, folk slowed down, they took head. Drivers are quite good really they can be programmed, educated; give the right people the tools to do the job.
However with this current trend of health and safety, human rights etc. you will always get someone who wants to hold people’s hands throughout their life. SHARP HARD LESSIONS need to be learnt, young drivers need to be shown they are not invincible. You only need to look in the local Lancashire newspapers, people die all the time on roads, and its nearly always down to driver error, a young girl was recently jailed from Kirkham for killing her friend and passenger for dangerous driving, was she really guilty or just poorly educated in relation to road safety and speed and how dangerous a car can really be. A motor vehicle is a weapon of mass destruction in the wrong hands.
I travel this road, a couple of times a month now, when visiting Darwen, it never ceases to amaze me at other drivers stupidity. Last Week I was driving back over the “tops” it was foggy, I was doing a slow 50, fog lights on etc., and people were still passing me, in the darn fog……..THAT’S stupidity, poor education.
Immediate solution, a couple of well-placed Police Road Traffic units, a few smashed cars, and long term education, police stop and educate programme and the current pain of my life Lancashire Police Traffic Camera Vans……. People will continue to be killed by their own stupidity till they realise the dangerous of this ROAD.
The configuration of this road has always meant people will speed. I learnt to drive in 1979 with my father and grandfather, we often travelled this road (the A666) past Bull Hill Maternity home then, and folk were speeding way back then. All too often these people have little regard for themselves or other peoples safety, give a boy a big toy and he will use it to the extreme. For as long as I can remember people have been banging on about the speed limit on this road. The current limits are fine, it’s the drivers that want educating, educating of the dangers of speed. You only need to look at the dry stone walling that boundaries the road, how many times has this been repaired over the last 30 years, oodles of times. I hate speed cameras, they are just a government cash cow in my opinion, but on this occasion this road needs a couple at least. As the Whitehall council said, flashing speed restriction signs, (but they can’t get them – utter cobblers – I can give you the name of a company that will make them to any specification), visible warning deterrents do work. Many years ago in another life, I ran a successful road safety campaign in the run up to Christmas about the dangers of drunk driving. We positioned smashed cars in various places along a problem road, not dissimilar to Bull Hill. Cars that had been involved in fatal crashes, with dummy’s hanging out of windows and such like, (sure you can picture this scene) blood and gore…….. It worked, shock factor, folk slowed down, they took head. Drivers are quite good really they can be programmed, educated; give the right people the tools to do the job. However with this current trend of health and safety, human rights etc. you will always get someone who wants to hold people’s hands throughout their life. SHARP HARD LESSIONS need to be learnt, young drivers need to be shown they are not invincible. You only need to look in the local Lancashire newspapers, people die all the time on roads, and its nearly always down to driver error, a young girl was recently jailed from Kirkham for killing her friend and passenger for dangerous driving, was she really guilty or just poorly educated in relation to road safety and speed and how dangerous a car can really be. A motor vehicle is a weapon of mass destruction in the wrong hands. I travel this road, a couple of times a month now, when visiting Darwen, it never ceases to amaze me at other drivers stupidity. Last Week I was driving back over the “tops” it was foggy, I was doing a slow 50, fog lights on etc., and people were still passing me, in the darn fog……..THAT’S stupidity, poor education. Immediate solution, a couple of well-placed Police Road Traffic units, a few smashed cars, and long term education, police stop and educate programme and the current pain of my life Lancashire Police Traffic Camera Vans……. People will continue to be killed by their own stupidity till they realise the dangerous of this ROAD. EX-Pat Local Man
  • Score: 2

11:57am Tue 27 Nov 12

burner says...

Hillbilly, you are definitely on the button there - "average speed" cameras WORK. Look at the M25 and the M42 ( OK, more accidents there, but a FAR higher volume of traffic and most respect the limit )
Hillbilly, you are definitely on the button there - "average speed" cameras WORK. Look at the M25 and the M42 ( OK, more accidents there, but a FAR higher volume of traffic and most respect the limit ) burner
  • Score: 0

2:05pm Tue 27 Nov 12

Judge Nic Sanders says...

The drivers were high on Cocaine and alcohol.
Highway code out of the window there.
The drivers were high on Cocaine and alcohol. Highway code out of the window there. Judge Nic Sanders
  • Score: 0

5:04pm Tue 27 Nov 12

Rumpole says...

50 mph to 40 mph to 30 mph with a camera just before the 30 mph sign, no excuses for speeding!
50 mph to 40 mph to 30 mph with a camera just before the 30 mph sign, no excuses for speeding! Rumpole
  • Score: 1

5:34pm Tue 27 Nov 12

Ian the Beancounter says...

I have travelled this road almost daily since 1971. It was far safer when the speed limit reduced gradually and drivers went from 50 to 40 to 30 in a controlled reduction in speed. Only the other day, I followed a driver travelling at around 50 who then braked hard to get down to 30. I was expecting it and adjusted accordingly, but people from outside the area may well have been caught out. The reduction in limit needs to be more gradual, but nothing will ever legislate for drunk/drug drivers.
I have travelled this road almost daily since 1971. It was far safer when the speed limit reduced gradually and drivers went from 50 to 40 to 30 in a controlled reduction in speed. Only the other day, I followed a driver travelling at around 50 who then braked hard to get down to 30. I was expecting it and adjusted accordingly, but people from outside the area may well have been caught out. The reduction in limit needs to be more gradual, but nothing will ever legislate for drunk/drug drivers. Ian the Beancounter
  • Score: 1

2:08pm Wed 28 Nov 12

johndarwen says...

The road is fine. Like every body knows.
The road has less accidents when people do not drink or takes drugs.
The road design is a fast road.
Remember the road used to be 60 mph.
An advanced driver can travel that road in dry weather conditions safely at 70 and not crash.
More people should be given driving lesson on how to drive, not just pass a test.
The road is fine. Like every body knows. The road has less accidents when people do not drink or takes drugs. The road design is a fast road. Remember the road used to be 60 mph. An advanced driver can travel that road in dry weather conditions safely at 70 and not crash. More people should be given driving lesson on how to drive, not just pass a test. johndarwen
  • Score: 0

4:30pm Wed 28 Nov 12

CapitaBackHander says...

So we DO need a Police Commisionaire! Why are the police attending? Two inquests into each incident clearly showed the drivers were drunk and in the last case on cocaine. The police should NOT be attending. Personally I think the speed limit should be raised to 50mph because that was safe for decades! Drivers of those houses should NOT reverse on to the main road and in my opinion should NOT park parallel to double white lines.
The road in 30mph section should not be a priority for any action. Shame I am out on Thursday because I would have gone and given a realistic view. Meeting for cars speeding up Borough Road? This is outside a school.
If a minibus drunk driver crashed and killed 8 passengers on a straight road with no hazards does that make it a death road?
So we DO need a Police Commisionaire! Why are the police attending? Two inquests into each incident clearly showed the drivers were drunk and in the last case on cocaine. The police should NOT be attending. Personally I think the speed limit should be raised to 50mph because that was safe for decades! Drivers of those houses should NOT reverse on to the main road and in my opinion should NOT park parallel to double white lines. The road in 30mph section should not be a priority for any action. Shame I am out on Thursday because I would have gone and given a realistic view. Meeting for cars speeding up Borough Road? This is outside a school. If a minibus drunk driver crashed and killed 8 passengers on a straight road with no hazards does that make it a death road? CapitaBackHander
  • Score: 0

4:36pm Wed 28 Nov 12

CapitaBackHander says...

P.s you can get repeater signs because other daft councils have done it. The rule should be - no speed limit sign then assume 30mph. Totally misses the point though, people are not speeding because they don't know the limit.
I hate the drivers who are on my rear end in thirty zone, I hit accelerator just before 50 sign and never see them again unless stuck in Bolton. Into Darwen yes people do speed but so what (no bigger problem than elsewhere).. no deaths caused by it.
P.s you can get repeater signs because other daft councils have done it. The rule should be - no speed limit sign then assume 30mph. Totally misses the point though, people are not speeding because they don't know the limit. I hate the drivers who are on my rear end in thirty zone, I hit accelerator just before 50 sign and never see them again unless stuck in Bolton. Into Darwen yes people do speed but so what (no bigger problem than elsewhere).. no deaths caused by it. CapitaBackHander
  • Score: 0

6:26pm Thu 29 Nov 12

now in the north says...

Its nothing to do with speed on any road, Speed is just the only factor that can be controlled by the powers that be, and the only factor that can financially benefit any department.
...
Lets look at the facts the last two serious accidents on that road were not at BULL HILL. One was, at bull hill, the driver "pleaded with Mr Amos to slow down. But he ignored their warnings and continued to accelerate, overtaking vehicles and weaving across the road.She said: “For some reason we ended up on the A666, but no-one questioned why we were there, then Lee’s driving got really erratic.".."She said: “For some reason we ended up on the A666, but no-one questioned why we were there, then Lee’s driving got really erratic. " .. The factors in this...erratic driving and "A SPEEDING driver was three-and-a-half times over the drink-drive limit when his car crashed into a lamppost"

The next crash was at CADSHAW ( there was video footage) "had been out drinking on the Saturday night before going to Mr Berry’s girlfriend’s in Egerton.At 2am, it was decided to go out to buy more alcohol"..."“When we got to Bull Hill, he sped up as it was open road. He didn’t have his seatbelt on as he was still mucking about in the door.As he went round the bend he slid into the barrier".."Mr Eatock was almost three times the legal limit for alcohol and had taken cocaine"

I see drinking being the biggest part of issues on that road by these cases.

I personally have reported a police man for overtaking on the wrong side of cadshaw bend and the hill that followed narrowly avoiding two cars by three foot max...his officer said he wasnt taking our statement further as the policeman involved had "never been reported before!
I also reported a speed camera van for tailgating me to 40 míles per hour in the 30 zone. No action taken as they are volunteers and he had never done anything like it before...
I drive that road daily..sometimes 8 times a day and the speed is not a problem.
Its idiotic actions of drivers overtaking and harrassing, swerving in and out and overtaking 6 or 7 vehicles at a time before forcing a 3 lane situation to escape death.
Micheal Shumacher could drive that road easily at speed, so its not speed thats an issue clearly...its 100% stupidity.
Its nothing to do with speed on any road, Speed is just the only factor that can be controlled by the powers that be, and the only factor that can financially benefit any department. ... Lets look at the facts the last two serious accidents on that road were not at BULL HILL. One was, at bull hill, the driver "pleaded with Mr Amos to slow down. But he ignored their warnings and continued to accelerate, overtaking vehicles and weaving across the road.She said: “For some reason we ended up on the A666, but no-one questioned why we were there, then Lee’s driving got really erratic.".."She said: “For some reason we ended up on the A666, but no-one questioned why we were there, then Lee’s driving got really erratic. " .. The factors in this...erratic driving and "A SPEEDING driver was three-and-a-half times over the drink-drive limit when his car crashed into a lamppost" The next crash was at CADSHAW ( there was video footage) "had been out drinking on the Saturday night before going to Mr Berry’s girlfriend’s in Egerton.At 2am, it was decided to go out to buy more alcohol"..."“When we got to Bull Hill, he sped up as it was open road. He didn’t have his seatbelt on as he was still mucking about in the door.As he went round the bend he slid into the barrier".."Mr Eatock was almost three times the legal limit for alcohol and had taken cocaine" I see drinking being the biggest part of issues on that road by these cases. I personally have reported a police man for overtaking on the wrong side of cadshaw bend and the hill that followed narrowly avoiding two cars by three foot max...his officer said he wasnt taking our statement further as the policeman involved had "never been reported before! I also reported a speed camera van for tailgating me to 40 míles per hour in the 30 zone. No action taken as they are volunteers and he had never done anything like it before... I drive that road daily..sometimes 8 times a day and the speed is not a problem. Its idiotic actions of drivers overtaking and harrassing, swerving in and out and overtaking 6 or 7 vehicles at a time before forcing a 3 lane situation to escape death. Micheal Shumacher could drive that road easily at speed, so its not speed thats an issue clearly...its 100% stupidity. now in the north
  • Score: 0

6:27pm Thu 29 Nov 12

now in the north says...

aoplogies for my bad cut n pasting...x
aoplogies for my bad cut n pasting...x now in the north
  • Score: 0

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