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[quote]has got the main star and [italic][bold]story[/bold][/italic] just about right. [/quote] Glad to see that you acknowledge that it's just a story, Kevin!! ;o)

Hi Kev, The Truest Miracle that Jesus ever did was that he came and resurrected the Heart and Soul of Humanity. Of Man. Man has a tendency to crucify his own Soul and forget the Divinity that makes Man Sacred. Man serves and bows before the constant wavering needs of his mind before the needs of his Eternal Heart and Soul. Jesus came to restore the Heart upon the Throne of Divinity. To Resurrect the Truth within Mans own Being.

The Life of Jesus did not begin with his Birth. His Birth was accidental to the nature of the physical world. No human can enter the world without the physical contribution of a woman and man. Jesus was as much of a human as human could be. He had human strengths and human vulnerabilities. However, it is also Important to remember that Jesus existed prior to his birth in the world. There has never been a time when the Eternal did not exist and there will never be a time when the Eternal will cease to exist. His birth and death are 'accidental' to him appearing in the Human world, in Human guise, for a Human amount of time. The Essence of Jesus was, is and will always be Eternal. The Physical Forms are only finite. He does not cease to Exist because he is no longer in the Human Universe. There has never been a time when the Immortal Consciousness did not Exist. There has never been a time when your Essential Consciousness did not EXIST. It will never cease to Exist. No matter what form it creates it will remain the Creator of that form. Jesus merely Created another form and another Universe in which that form could dwell. Consciousness is a Powerful tool when it comes to Creation.

You do realise there has never been a time when you did not exist. There may have been a period of time when you did not Celebrate Your Eternal Existence. But there has never, ever been a time when you did not have it. The Stage of This Earth, This Garden, is as good a place as any to Celebrate that! You do Realise there has never been a time when you will cease to Exist.

[bold]or even never will be a time![/bold]

I really give up here Kevin<rolls eyes> they make a play out of Anthony and Cleopatra,Romeo and Juliet,and this passion stuff brings the story of Jesus right down to the level of a best sellor, or Top oscar winning film. If we are to believe that christ did all this suffering for us, well lets not make it a box office success with a film directors slant on it,it borders on blasphemy does this,but then again there is no such thing as blasphemy anymore is there? Jesus did fullfill O/T bible prophecy with all the happenings of that week,he also allowed us to be forgiven of the sins of Adam,just as long as we accept him being the son of god and put our trust in him,i like that thought the gentiles were now brought into the scheme of things by him,but were does all this leave Muslims,Jews,Buddist s,millions of chinese and russians and Laps in Outer Mongalia i could go on and on about people who have not been as lucky as ourselves and had it pushed down there throat at school or at sunday school,maybe we ARE the chosen people after all..

Nosty, ALL THE PEOPLE HAVE BEEN CHOSEN TO EXIST. Nobody is left out. Religious differences are utterly irrelevent. Total Falshoods. My Dogma barks louder than your Dogma is not going to wash with God. God does not read and study the Dogma. It is Human Life that is Sacred. Man has put the Dogma bvefore the Sanctity of Life. Before the Blessing of Life. Man has made the words more Divine than the Life he has that allows him to read the words. Man has fallen into THE PIT of ignorance. Life is Your Next Breath, not another alphabet. It is not Dogma that is Divine. It is Life, it is this Breath. [bold]That is Divine.[/bold]

The Elect are those who have the Grace to Recognise the Divine when it is right under their nose. Everyone has the attention of Divinity, right under their nose. Not everyone receives the Grace that will allow them to Recognise it. Not everyone lifts up their Heart to ACCEPT IT!

Those Hearts with the Grace to Receive the Divinity. They are Truly, Truly Blessed!

A Breath is an Eternal source of Bliss! It brings with it a Heaven sent Joy! Extracting the Joy that comes with every Breath is the only Quest that needs to be resolved. This is the QUEST OF MAN.

Hi simplysimon Much of what you write is good. But some makes me wonder. In summary you believe that finding the Eternal is the quest of all humanity. The Eternal is God. Jesus is the Eternal who existed before he came to Panet Earth. Hope I've got you accurately in this nutshell. So far so good. You can say all this with the authority of the Bible backing you. But then you go on to write that we are all Eternal. We have all existed before. You write above... [bold]You do realise there has never been a time when you did not exist. There may have been a period of time when you did not Celebrate Your Eternal Existence. But there has never, ever been a time when you did not have it.[/bold] How do you know, simplysimon? Is this a personal opinion or do you make this claim backed by an authority beyond what you feel inside?

Hi Folks. Been off line for some while. My email's not been very well (aah). Nosty, You're fretting about those who haven't heard of Jesus - a genuine concern. You write above that you like the idea of the Gentiles being brought into the scheme of things... [bold]"but were does all this leave Muslims,Jews,Buddist s, millions of chinese and russians and Laps in Outer Mongalia..[/bold] First, we know God in his Son loves all of us enough to stretch out on a bloody and painful cross to save humanity. Secondly, if he does this then he loves those in Outer Mongolia enough to have a salvation plan, one that is just and loving for them, and all of humanity. Thirdly, he hasn't seen fit to outline his Outer Mongolia scheme in full, though he's given us hints about the fate of those not in the know(in Romans 10 & 11). Those who see the full truth will be dealt with justly and with love. Fourthly, if God had given us the answer to ever difficult question in the world, the libraries of Planet Earth would need large extensions. Finally, When I look at what he has created and designed and sustains; when I see his love extending down to save us and show us the way to him; when I analyse all he's done for me personally over four decades; I'm comfortable with leaving the fate of Outer Mongolia in his loving and just arms. Of course, this is a matter of personal trust, isn't it? I suppose this is the key area Jesus has been challenging his disciples about in this week's TV drama - The Passion. Do you trust me? Do you not yet see who I really am? God

Dear Kev. Your body is made of matter, it appears for a time. Matter is in the grip of Time. Time, the seasons of change have an effect on matter. Eventually the physical material will perish as it is subject to Time. It goes back to the elements from which it has been made. The heat of the body will rise upwards and return to the sun. The water in the body will vaporise and be carried by the wind eventually returning to the ocean. The nutrients that your body took from the earth will be returned to the earth. These are the elements from which the body has been made. The Power of this Breath will take Your Consciousness, your Being, Your five Senses back to the source from which these Eternal Elements came. These Elements are not subject to Time. They reside within the finite body for a duration of Time. These Elements are Immortal. They return to the Immortal. I am part Immortal. I only 'appear' to be Mortal. I know my Eternal Self. I enjoy the Companionship of the ETERNAL. Obviously, when you hang out with the Eternal you get to learn a few things. A True Human Being is part Mortal and Part Immortal. There is Mortal wisdom and Eternal wisdom. The Infinite resides within the finite. I know the difference. Anyone can. Anyone who feels the urge to Discover the Infinite for themselves. I don't know if I can answer your Question. It is something A Man must Understand standing on his own two feet, with the abilities he has been given. Someone was kind enough to plant an Eternal seed in the field of my Heart. They left it up to me. I began to learn about my Self.

[bold]My Eternal Self.[/bold]

There has never been a time when I was not. I did not begin. I do not cease to Exist. Jesus was the mortal 'appearance' of the Invisible Eternal Authority. He was one with that Authority. An Instrument of the Eternal Divinity on this EARTH. There were those who Recognised him with their Heart and there were those who didn't have a clue what he was on about. How can there be any Higher Authority than [bold]The Heart within Man.[/bold]

Thank you Kevin for your explanation,but this does lead me to say, that kind of reply does encompass all i have deemed untrue about your way of worship,because you are starting to speak for,secound guess or even sumise what Jesus will or would do,but there is one thing that Jesus did say and that is,the only way is through me,not if i dont get round to giving half the world a chance to know me,no worries because i have put something in place for that(Romans 10/11 does not cover this for me) and even if they have never known about me they can still come in,just doesnt fit well with my thinking there Kevin,lets face it if this all powering god, could not make sure that everyone in the world got instruction in his words and a chance for us all to take it onboard or reject it,and not give preference to Western europeans because they have been taught it in some form since birth and so should accept it more readily.It really doesnt seem he has played fair. These questions that god as not given us the answers to are perfectly good questions,and call me Thomas if you will but they do leave lots to be desired and to simply brush them off is taking blind faith miles to far imo,but as you say it is a personl oppinion. May i wish you a good and happy easter..

Hi Nosty Everyone has a Heart. Everyone has a Breath. Everyone has Consciousness. These are the attributes of the Eternal. Whether you can read and write has nothing to do with anything. The Kingdom of Heaven is within you. It is within everyone. It could not possibly come any closer. Fall in Love with what you have been given. Learn to Adore what you have. Who cares what you did. There is no past in eternity. whatever you aquired you will not keep, there is no future in eternity. Cherish this Breath. Cherish this Consciousness with all your Heart. Not one Soul will be impeded from entering the kingdom of Heaven. They may choose to exclude themselves if that is their wish.

At the time appointed,You will leave this world with only the original things with which you came into the world. Nobody came with a Teaching. Everyone came with ONE Breath. Your Heart and Soul will leave with ONE Breath. Your Heart and Soul came into the temple of the body with a Breath. It will leave with a Breath.

Hi simplysimon I'm interested in how you know you existed before you arrived on Planet Earth. You seem to be staking your whole life and future on simply saying your Eternal. Can you tell me how you know and why we should believe you?

Whoops! Sorry, simplysimon, i missed one of your replies - you send so many. In it you gave your explanation of why you think we are eternal - i.e. because our microscopic bits and pieces are. However, this doesn't seem to add much. I can see how our atoms, elements etc, go on and on, but how can you say you're eternal. As you say yourself, you don't know how to explain it. I don't want to be a kill joy, but do you not think you should have some evidence before you believe in something? Is a feeling adequate, knowing how fallible we are as human beings?

[quote]Is this a personal opinion or do you make this claim backed by an authority beyond what you feel inside?[/quote] Intersting question you asked of Simon there Rev. One can ask exactly the same question to any man of religion - all have the same answer.

Dear Kevin, I can show you the Eternal. I am not asking you to believe my words. I can Introduce you to the Eternal. Un-like Religion which has only succeeded in covering up it's lack of Knowledge of the Eternal with a big pile of Dogma. Religion should be banned from using the word. It has no clue what the Eternal actually is. It assumes it does without ever having encountered it. Whatever the Eternal touches becomes Eternal. It has obviously not touched Christianity. No man, not even Jesus could explain the Eternal. No words of any man could explain it. The ETERNAL IS BEYOND ANY DEFINITION. Jesus SHOWED IT to the Disciples. Not just talk about it wrapped up in a pile of Dogma and vague mystfying notions. Eternal Life is within you. It has never been anywhere else and it is impossible to replicate or Imagine. Either you Know or you don't know. Religion is not an Honest Institution. It suggests it begins after Death. If this is True, can you explain to me how something Eternal can ever have a beginning? I would like to hear any Christian or Muslim or Catholic, or any Theist explain that.

Dear Kevin, In answer to one of your Questions. I Was existing Before there was a planet Earth. I have never needed to concern myself with how or why I came to exist. How and why you exist ? That is a matter for you humans to resolve. I suggest you start addressing it while there is still time. Eternal Life is not a Religious brand or lifestyle option.

I only provide Evidence to those who need it. Eternal Life is either a luxury or a neccessity. [bold]I can afford to let you decide which it is.[/bold] I do not ask anyone to believe that which is impossible to believe. Death-bed decisions count for nothing.

[quote]I don't want to be a kill joy, but do you not think you should have some evidence before you believe in something?[/quote] Oooh! The irony - it burns! Especially from a bible beating cdesign proponentist.

[quote][bold]N 'Man O' Rage' R[/bold] wrote: [quote]I don't want to be a kill joy, but do you not think you should have some evidence before you believe in something?[/quote] Oooh! The irony - it burns! Especially from a bible beating cdesign proponentist.[/quote] Well spotted than Man! Quite typical religious hypocracy though, [bold]YOU[/bold] need evidence, but [bold]MY[/bold] faith doesn't. . . . .

Kev, Your very Existence is being Cherished by the most Powerful Power in the whole Universe. You ask for EVIDENCE? NO! What You need is that simple sweet ACCEPTANCE!

We are chameleons, we know how to change colours. Imagine a house with five rooms - green, yellow, purple, pink, red. We go into one room, and we become the same colour as the room. That is what we have been doing. I am a brother, and then, now I am a father, now I am an employee, now I am an employer, now I am a vicar, now I am a doctor, now I am a lawyer. Chameleons. We know how to blend in. We not only know how to blend in with our surroundings, but we blend in so much that we begin to forget ourselves. We forget that little child-like quality we had that was simple. Think way back to that little child that Loved Happiness with all his might! Remember that child who could not wait for his day to begin! Every morning the child looked forward to something. Yesterday, Gone! didn't matter. The future? not even on the little childs agenda. Today is everything! To wake up and see the sun. To look outside with fresh eyes. So simple! so innocent! so INCREDIBLE! And then, a little of this and a little of that and slowly the Peace we enjoyed went away. And all that we thought was going to bring us Joy one day now brings us pain. And when it does, we say - "what happened? All I want is Peace. All I want is Joy in my Life" That's when People say, "what can I do" Even in that Moment, know that all the Joy is still there. All the Beauty is still there - It never went away. That child is still alive and is living in us. He is still there asking for the same thing, to be Content. No more wishes than that. Just to be Content. Children are obsessed by the business of Joy. Watch a little child playing. There is an obsession with satisfaction, with contentment. The child cries for one reason. He is not content. And He laughs for one reason - He is content. He has no Tomorrow. His sense of responsibility is to wake up with the sun. "I am Awake!" Approach this subject of Life with the same simplicity. There is no mistake being made when it is said that we should approach our thirst with the Heart of a child. The child requires no definitions. No protocol to Accept what it needs. [bold]Receive the Keys to[/bold] [bold]Knowledge[/bold] with simplicity. Come with the Heart of that Innocent child. Come with an open Heart, not confusion and doubt. As human beings. Our strength is not in doubt. It is in Understanding. Our strength is not in questions, it is in Answers. Our strength is not in ignorance, it is in KNOWLEDGE. That is our strength. It doesn't matter who we are, what we are doing. We can Dance this Dance of Life! This Dance is REAL! Our expression of Gratitude in feeling thankful for this Life.

Believe it or not but this thread shows quite clearly that all who have a belief in the super natural,James with his eternal and Kevin with his religion,must have what i might call an inner calling to make them so convinced that the road they are travelling is the correct one,does this make them spiritually minded? or just some kind of persons who could be very close to being lunatic's,this is not meant to be a hurtfull comment,i am just wondering why myself and many others cannot get as involved with these beliefs as they do,even though we have had more or less the same type of education on the subject,maybe it would be best if i dont ask myself to many questions.I do feel though that man in the guise of religion does make answers up,and to be honest i would prefer someone to say,sorry but i dont know the answer to that question.

Nostradamus, When we forget who we really are, we try to find another identity. But it never really fits us. It constricts us. We impose our own limits on our selves and forget our possibilities are more real than our limitations. No matter what, you have the Possibility to be Content. No Matter what you have the Possibility to be Fulfilled. No matter what, you have the Possibility, the potential, to find the Ultimate Joy, Your Perfect Heaven. People do not grow old. they just stop dreaming of their possibilities. Every day that you are Alive! You have the Possibility to re-Discover that Beauty. You can re-collect that Perfect 'Sense' of who you really are. When you remember that you have that Possibility, and when you Accept that Possibility. That Possibility becomes a Reality. A 'Perfect Reality' for you. A 'Perfect Day' for you. Then you go to sleep, everything is erased, and you awaken to another day. No two days are ever repeated. But the Possibility of re-discovering the Perfection will never go away. Every single day, right up to the very last day. the very last Breath. That Possibility will remain. Never let go of this Possibility, and the rest becomes Automatic. Whatever that Perfection touches becomes itself Perfect! That Possibility has just touched your Day! Ask your self this question, 'am I ready to Accept it'? You will find that Your Truest Answer is within you.

The Possibility is so Beautiful! That even the Answer is Sweet.

Ever since I was a little child I wanted to Appreciate being me. Every Day! In fact, Forever is not long enough! [bold]I don't think we are so different.[/bold]

No matter what, you have the Possibility to be Content. No Matter what you have the Possibility to be Fulfilled. No matter what, you have the Possibility, the potential, to find the Ultimate Joy, Your Perfect Heaven. -------------------- -------------------- --- James.what on earth makes you think that i am not any feeling i have all of those things? I am not looking for anything ,i am very content and at peace within myself...

Why would you be content and at peace with your self Nostradamus ? or Why are some People not ?

I don't think I ever said you were not Content or at Peace. Why does a person have to be Dead [bold]before[/bold] they can enter Heaven would be the only question I would ask a representative of religion.? You MUST be looking for something. What do you mean you are not looking for anything? [bold]Everyone[/bold] is looking for something! we all [bold]Hope[/bold] for something!

When we have nothing else left to Hope for we always Hope for the ETERNAL! Because Hope is an attribute of the Eternal. I know I do.

QUOTE JAMES... you have the Possibility to be Content. -------------------- ------------------ Mmmm James, i take that as it would be possible for me to be content,well i would like mto say that i am content and as i said i am not looking for anything either,good luck to you in your quest for peace and fullfilment..

Hi Nosty, If you are not looking for 'something' you would not bother to get out of bed in the morning. Your nature is to look, to Hope, for 'something'. You MUST be Hoping for 'something' You have no choice in the matter. It is part of your nature. You seem to be denying that part of your nature. Yesterday, you felt hungry. you satisfied that hunger. The desire for food has not been annihilated because you satisfied it yesterday. That Desire is still there. You felt hungry today. You satisfied it today and it will be there tomorrow. Urging you once again to get the satisfaction, the food you need. The desire for your Heart to be Content will not go away because you did something to be content yesterday. It will be there every day. You cannot satisfy it once and never have to satisfy it again. You cannot eat once and never feel hungry again. Today your Heart is looking to be Content. It is Hoping you will find Contentment Today. Yesterdays Contentment has gone. You may think you have found Contentment. But do not be fooled by thinking. Your stomach will not be fooled by thinking about yesterdays dinner. Whatever happened in the past will not satisfy your Heart Today! Feeling that Beautiful feeling of Contentment and Thinking you have everything you need are not the same thing. Everyday this Heart within Man is calling out to be Content! I Hope you do not ignore this Quest.

It is this possibility that every Man has. He MUST respond to it. In thought, in word, in deed. No Man has a choice. Is Man re-acting to a human need or responding to the Heart of his Being. Ask any woman.

Of course james the things you mention are of course needed everyday of your life,and yes i do look to stisfy my needs to live everyday,but in the context that you talk in,i do feel very content and very happy with life.

Nostradamus, But what is that Contentment and Happiness built on? Many People are content and happy, as long as things are going their way. Many People have their reasons to be content and happy. What happens when they are not Content and happy. When things don't work out. When things don't go to plan. When there is a shipwreck in their life. How can People be content and happy when something not nice happens. Can People be Content and Happy under any circumstances. No holds barred. That's the Quest I am talking about. The Shipwreck will come. One day everything we treasure will be taken away.

On that day what will you cling to.?

[quote][bold]simplysimon[/bold] wrote: On that day what will you cling to.?[/quote] James i ma content with my lot at this moment in the now,but through my life i have had trials and tribulations and i will take it all as it comes my friend,there challenges which must and can be overcome,if you live your life and believe in fATE Then it;s QUE SERA SERA,no other way to look at it mate,what will, be will be..Ad Finem..

Happiness is to do with happenings. If the happenings are good, we're happy. If not, we're sad. Christian joy, on the other hand, is to do with one happening - Jesus. He lived and died and rose again. He is the way, the truth and the life. When He's in your life, you know joy. Whatever happens!

We are all happy little souls then,,lol

Dear Kev. Happiness is not a consequence. Happiness is a Beautiful feeling. Children can manage that without clinging to the crutch of Religion or the crotch of a dead hero. If Children can know Joy. If Children can Know Peace. If Children can be Fulfilled. What is the problem with Adults.? That they need a pile of Dogma. What is so terrible about a full Heart?

Nobody came into this world with a religion and no one will be leaving it with one. We can only leave with the original that we came with.

When we came, we came with a Heart that was Full, Complete, Pure and Overflowing. No questions. No doubts. No confusions. No belief was required. The day we were told that The Pure Heart within us was not enough was the day we fell victim to a lie. No amount of Dogma will produce a Pure Heart. A Pure Heart cannot be re-produced. Religion keeps reminding us that our Heart is impure. It has never been impure. Man has put the formulae of Religion before it. Higher than it. There is nothing more Divine in Man than a Pure Heart. A Heart that is Pure is always Full. A Heart that is Full is Complete. No amount of formulae will ever fill it. Religion may satisfy the mind of Man, but it will never satisfy the Heart. Living People need a Fulfilled Heart. Living People need a Living Heart. Not a new Religion. Not an old Religion. It is time the Pure Heart was re-presented to Mankind.

There is no such thing as Christian Joy. Muslim Joy or Catholic Joy. Red Joy or Green Joy. Arthurs Joy or Marthas Joy. There is only Joy! Either you feel the Joy! or you don't. The Heart Loves to feel un-alloyed Joy! Fulfillment is when you feel Joy and you don't even know the reason. That's JOY! Let's keep Joy nice and clean and simple. It's the People's [italic][bold]Thirst[/bold][/italic] for Joy that needs to be kept glowing-hot and fire-like.

Whatever your Religion, Theist or Atheist, In This [bold]Reality[/bold] of Heaven Your Heart and Your Soul will be included.

Well!, with just a little help from you goodself James this thread hit 50 replies,,,lol

I know I can go on a bit. I knocked up 25,000 on the forum 'Your Seeds' thread.

[bold]Divinity is not a Dead Hero.[/bold]

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